Cindy Sheehan responds

Bless her, I hope she runs for national office. Again, I say to you people: Bush scares me, he is truly evil, a bad, bad person. His henchmen and minions and the secret leaders who tell him what to do are conspiring to change the world for teh worse and they are half-way there.

...and for all you brainwashed idiots who keep mentioning Cindy Sheehan's meeting with Hugo Chavez, I think Chavez is a great leader, with incredible intelligence, courage and charisma. Most of the countries in South America recently elected leaders who know Bush and his henchmen are criminals and killers, and they say so, and for that they are labeled "bad men" by the comedians on FOX entertainment channel. The bush administration loves democracy unless they don't like the leader, then they attempt to kill him or undermine his country. Democracy, bush style. I wish Chavez was the president of the United States. At least we would all get free healthcare and education.

If Chavez were the US president, this and other newspapers would be owned by the state and would be printing out the official government line. If you enjoy living in a controlled speech and press environment, then you would love him as president. As it currently is, perhaps you would love it in Venezuela. Sure, he was democratically elected. But just because the leader is democratically elected does not mean that the leader is good or just. I mean, look at Bush. He was democratically elected, right? When did the left become so enamored with wanna-be dictators? Sheehan hanging out with Saddam Hussein's lawyer? Maybe her message is worthwhile, but she's become a caricature of the loony left.

As much as Ms. Sheehan will dislike hearing it, any first year law student can tell you that the First Amendment freedom of speech is not absolute. The U.S. Supreme Court long ago determined that governments, including the federal government, may place reasonable restrictions as to time, place and manner upon otherwise protected speech. The President is Constitutionally obligated to report to the Congress (and, by tradition, the nation) on the state of the Union. (Constitution, Art. II, Sec. 3.) It is therefore reasonable for that obligation to take some precedence over the interests and agenda of an individual or individuals who wish to use that occasion to make their own opinions heard (or, in this instance, seen).
Ms. Sheehan's own account of the events demonstrates that she was not being singled out based upon her identity or even her message: upon seeing her shirt, the security officer simply called out "Protester." I have heard reports on a radio station in Chicago (WGN, which is owned by the Tribune Company)-- admittedly, not confirmed by this writer -- that the wife of a Congressional Representative was also removed from the Chamber (though reportedly not arrested) for wearing a shirt bearing a slogan in support of our troops. This, if true, demonstrates even-handed enforcement unrelated to the content of the speech at issue. Even members of both houses of Congress and of both parties demonstrate respect for the occasion and limit the expression of their views to either offering or withholding their applause on specific points. No one is questioning Ms. Sheehan's right to express her opinion; only her right to do so at that time, in that place and in that manner.

Stan, apparently you don't read, or can't read. Otherwise you would have 100 examples of censorship and government interference of the press from Bush's administration and cronies in the last few years alone. You say the papers in Venezuela are state owned, what's your point? So what, why does that make it evil. Hmm, let's give some examples: No US newspaper talks about the illegal renditions anymore, Venezuelan newspapers did. No US newspaper prints stories of the US using white phosphorous on Iraqi citizens, Venezuelan newspapers did. Hmm, no US newspapers print the uproar over the Downing St. memos, but guess what newspaper did? Look at FOX news, your bible, that's a state owned news comedy channel that re-states the white house line of the day, or intentionally misleads Americans by putting stories of missing white girls on while Bush administration officials are being indicted. Look Stan, learn to think independently, don't let those jokers on FOX decide what leaders are good or bad, do the research. I would take Hugo Chavez over Bush any day of the week.

Stan,

Its funny that you talk about State-run press. Sure, we don't have the same restricted press that Venezeula or other countries that do not have a free press, but how far away are we really?

With the New York Times basically printing White House press releases in the run up to the war, our press generally burying the Iraq war story or not reporting it at all, what do we really have? Maybe we don't have state-run press... we have something worse... we have lazy press. We have a press that allows the policies of this country to go unchecked and largely unquestioned. The Bush White House is good for corporate America (unless you're an employee) so why would they want to challenge it? They ARE corporate America.

So no, we don't have a State-run Press, we have a corporate run press. From where I sit I'm not seeing much of a difference these days.

J. Arrigo wrote: "The wife of a Congressional Representative was also removed from the Chamber (though reportedly not arrested) for wearing a shirt bearing a slogan in support of our troops. This, if true, demonstrates even-handed enforcement unrelated to the content of the speech at issue."

In fact, J., it demonstrates exactly the opposite. You're obviously online, so I'm surprised you didn't do a little Google News search to find out all the facts. Even cnn.com (not known for being a leftist bastion) announced in a headline, "Shirt tales differ."

The congressional wife was Beverly Young, a Republican. I'd say the political/philosophical difference between the two women is significant. The fact that Ms. Young was "asked to leave" (CNN's words) but not arrested clearly demonstrates unlawful, unequal treatment. The authorities handled the two women differently, a decision that appears to be based on the content of the messages on their T-shirts.

I am eager to learn if Ms. Young was physically removed and handcuffed, like Ms. Sheehan; I doubt she was. (OK, Swamp bloggers, would you please investigate?) Regardless, at the end of the day, there's still a big difference between ejection and (false) arrest.

I hope Cindy Sheehan sues.

That Ms Sheehan has had her son killed in war on the orders of Mr. Bush is terrifying, to her and the rest of the world, as is the death of any child. Mr. Bush might, some day, think long and hard about what he has asked people to do.

That Ms Sheehan has been heaved out of the PEOPLES' Congress building in Washington is a complete disgrace. She has every right to protest, most especially on the evening that the big, brave President (who has never seen action, for some odd reason) was going to make a speech to the representatives of the US people. Her attire was neither rude nor disruptive. Unless someone is afraid of her.

Exactly who is Mr. Bush afraid of? He does not seem to be afraid, any longer, of Iraqis. Mr. Bush is merely annoyed with Iraqis. Mr. Bush is a bit afraid of Mexicans, and President Hugo Chavez of Venezuela, but is he afraid of Americans? The people who (he believes) elected him to the highest office in the land? Mr. Bush seems to be afraid of Americans. (And many, and more, Americans seem to be tiring of Mr. Bush and his antics passed off as 'leadership'.)

What a dreadful shame. Ms Sheehan, or any American, must be free at any time to wear a shirt numbering the dead in war. Any number is a tragic toll to proclaim. Mr. Bush has not even shown the decency to attend any of the funerals for sailors, soldiers or air crew under his command who have been killed doing their duty to his office. What a quotient of courage it seems to take to be Mr. Bush.

Events such as this show that Mr. Bush is now afraid of himself. And finally, in sadness and solidarity, much of the rest of the world is laughing sadly at him as he paints himself into a corner. It is to be hoped he takes no more good people with him on his lonely journey.

Ms Sheehan deserves more than an apology; she deserves to make a State of the Union Address herself, to the same Congress faced by Mr. Bush. Her message would, undoubtedly, be somewhat different than his.

Cindy Sheehan needs to get off the stage and go back under the rock she came from. The following are some of the anti-semitic remarks she made when she was sitting in her ditch in Crawford, Texas last summer:

"[My son] was killed for a neo-con agenda that only benefits a very chosen few in this world. This agenda and their war machine will chew up and spit out as many of our children as they can unless we stop them now. We should not let Israel/USA invade Syria or Iran."

"You get America out of Iraq and Israel out of Palestine and you’ll stop the terrorism."

"Am I emotional? Yes, my first born was murdered. Am I angry? Yes, he was killed for lies and for a Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel."
"My son joined the Army to protect America, not Israel."

“George Bush and his neo-conservatives killed my son/ America has been killing people on this continent since it was started. This country is not worth dying for.”

Since she hates this country so much she should join her hero Mr. Chavez in Venezuala and trade places with someone from that country trying to escape to the U.S.

Where was all this press for the mothers that still have sons missing in Vietnam? Oh wait its not anti Bush so no one cares about them.

Her son made the choice to join the military. Those who join the military understand the risks involved. People in the military die, it happens. Two military personel died in a training accident this week. Was that the Presidents fault for forcing them to train?

Personaly if I was invited to any State of the Union, I would wear my best suit and difintaly not wear a shirt with writing on it.

Regardless of what I think of her political agenda, She is a Gold Star Mother. And she deserves the respect of all Americans for what she has lost.

Stan,
Actually, I think that state owned media is probably more prone to speak truthfully than media that depends on its state issued license for its financial well being.
Jeff

Stan: Venezuela has a much freer press than we do here in the US. It is NOT state owned, and is in fact very anti-Chavez. Check your facts!

The people that post comentaries about Venezuela's press, are at best ignorant, at worse disingenuous.

Most of the Venezuelan Press is, and has been in the hands of the opposition to Chavez, ie, Higher class industrials/ politicians of the corrupt old guard

So far they have been no closures in Venezuelan press. The caricature of the State controlled press in the Venezuelan 'dictatorship', the wide spread repression of the freedom of speech there does not fit the facts.

FOR ONCE, do not content yourselves to read what the INDEED biased and self sensored editorials of the Wall Street Journal and the NYT tell you.
LOOK for yourselves,
It is quite doable in the 21rst Century

When I was a child, the Constitution, particularly the Bill of Rights made our country the moral leader of the world.

What happened?

Her intent was to disrupt. She has done her son wrong and it is he that we should feel sorry for not her. She was not arrested. Thank you for odjectionally showing both sides. (SHOCKER)

Cindy Sheehan is a disgrace to America. Bush has not enforced a draft. Meaning, all the soldiers in Iraq are there because THEY WANT TO BE THERE.

Maybe Ms. Sheehan should think about her son's wishes instead of her own.

Maybe Ms. Sheehan should leave America. Seeings how she is oh so upset with how America has turned out.

I know that if MY mother was protesting against a government that I had risked my life for and unfortunately died, I would roll over in my grave. I don't understand why the left can't get it through their thick skulls that this is WAR and it IS NOT going away. TERRORISM is real! This isn't a tea party.

The left portrays the right as being war hungry lunitics. Well, we're not. No one LIKES war. It just so happens to be a necessary evil. This isn't a war about oil. This is a war about FREEDOM.

I think Cindy Sheehan should be ashamed of herself.

That's just my two cents worth.

I am so pleased to see this article reprinted in a Chicago Tribune company property. Did they have the courage to run it on their pages? The front page? Sheehand writes: "I have lost my First Amendment rights. I have lost the country that I love. Where did America go?" People who have not been feeling this ever since congress rushed through the Patriot Act have not been paying attention. Coverage of our vanishing Civil Liberties should be the number one priority of all media outlets at this place and time. Thanks for putting this on-line but I hope it made the daily.

Gee surprise surprise.....Cindy Sheehan knew full well what she was doing, that her actions would cause a stir and thus draw more attention to herself and her
cause, plain and simple. I'm personally tired of her
road show and disrespect for the President....its Bush....not Bushco Ms Sheehan......plenty of mothers
have lost sons to this war which would have been fought sooner or later in one manner or other.....I can sympathise with her loss but not the way she's going about it.

God bless America! I think people in america take their liberties for granted. In India a person like Cindy Sheehan would not have been just arrested and released. Instead, she would have been tortured(most likely killed in police custody),and her whole family would have been arrested and torured as well. In America, a person like Cindy sheehan is allowed to protest but like the previous post has stated, there is a time and place for these things. The American governemnt's functioning is adored by the world over. I don't know if Americans know how the Indian parliamet works, (most likely not because American media coverage of world affairs is almost non-existent unless it deals with oil-rich nations), but in the Indian parliament people start throwing their shoes at each other, start throwing punches etc. The State-of-the-Union Address is supposed to be an orderly speech intended for America to hear what the President of the United States has to say.

Be proud that we can protest in this country without the fear of torture and custodial murder. Don't get spoiled with what we have here.

peace.

In the case of both women removed, and the difference therein, there's some much simpler explanations than these nearly consiratory theories offered up.

Maybe the reaction was different because there was an overzealous Capitol cop that "caught" Sheehan's shirt and removed her. It could possibly be that the whole issue was NOT due to Bush's policies or the War in Iraq or anything else but some cops who were hell-bent on not allowing any messages from the gallery that weren't part of the planned event. Like it or not, the State of the Union is not a place for a free-for-all, which is what probably inspired Sheehan's treatment.

Five cops beat the stuffing out of a guy who they'd already put on the ground only a few days ago, somewhere in America. My outrage is reserved for him, not someone who claims to have only opened her jacket to cool off after a long walk up many stairs. I don't buy the "Mickey the Dunce" act. (Sheehan claims this, and that's just silly considering all the other publicity stunts she's been involved in, whether her point is valid or not.)

On the political and policy activism front, Sheehan, for what good she's done, also attracts the mental mayhem of some melodramatic, misguided and unschooled people (by example, 'theTRUTHtheLIGHT' in this comment post).

I hope she sues and wins for the treatment. I hope it doesn't prove to be a faltering attempt at being the country's latest wannabe martyr.

Is this not what she wanted in the first place? The fact that she was given the the ticket by an outspoken person like Wollsey proves that. Im sure this is more than she could have hoped for and will milk this for a few more minutes of fame. This is not to say I do not aggree with her, but the sky is falling and crying wolf helps no one. She started off great and has went down hill from there. She is no longer the grieving mother, but she falls back on that when it suits her. Just because she or her backers think it is so does not make it so. Same goes for Bush and his side, the truth is somewhere in the middle.

Several comments have expressed outrage that the Republican administration would remove a liberal protester from the state of the union address.

But what would Bill have done? If Clinton were still President, and a conservative showed up at the state of the union address with a t-shirt stating: "X number of Branch Davidians killed" or "X number of extramarital affairs," or "X number of deaths in Bosnia," or some other inflammatory statement relating to the Presidency, do you think Clinton would have left them in the room?

No. Any president would have removed a protestor from the room. Cindy Sheehan is actually an easy case, because everyone knows she was there to make a scene. That's what she does. The only reason any of us know who she is is because she habitually gets as close as she can to President Bush and then makes a scene.

Shame on the members of Congress who invited her. They knew exactly what would happen.

Someone who really cares about Ms. Sheehan should get her enrolled in grief counseling. It is truly tragic that her son died, and she needs to find an effective way of dealing with the loss.

I called Rep. Young's office yesterday saying I supported his wife's right to free speech as well as Cindy Sheehan's! When I read his statement this morning my blood boiled!

Young said he wouldn't be so mad if it were just Sheehan. "I totally disagree with everything she stands for," he said.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ wp...20100348_2.html
But by removing his wife, Gainer's officers clearly "acted precipitously," Young said.

I guess most Republicans have never been in a "Free Speech Zone"! I called his office and told them I hope he is tarred and feathered for not upholding his oath to the US Constitution to protect and defend ALL OF OUR LIBERTIES, not just Republicans! The Republic IS DEAD!

Boo-Hoo, Boo-hoo, boo-hoo-hoo! Serves her right, who does she think she is? She is a wirthless piece of crap and we do not need her stinking up our house!

The amusing thing is that Venezuela actually have free media that are quite vocal in bashing Chavez. I'm not sure why one idiot's statement (Stan's) was taken for granted.

The amusing thing is that Venezuela actually has free media that are quite vocal in bashing Chavez. I'm not sure why one idiot's statement (Stan's) was taken for granted.

THIS IS NOT AMERICA! We here in these 50 states are living in a corporate-fascist state of fear and control. Ms. Sheehan and her struggles only highlight one aspect of this. Mr. Bush and COMPANY may not have started this version of friendly fascism, but they certainly have made it more obvious, visible and mean. One day Ms. Sheehan will be championed as a modern-day Rosa Parks for conviction of purpose. Until then we will continue to be oppressed and our FREEDOMS & LIBERTIES diminished. For what I ask? There will be dark days ahead until we act like our (mythical)ideals command.

Watching the American fascist agenda successfully unfold has made me committed to become involved in our political process...not because I have time or money...but because I love freedom and liberty. I know that I am only one of millions and millions. I see the Bush regime as a catalyst for Americans to get involved in our peoples' government to take it back. So...thank you Mr. Bush. The people's revolution has begun. We will get our beloved America back...

Give it a rest already Cindy Sheehan. I don't think there is anyone who doesn't feel remorse for you concerning the loss of your son. He (your son) signed up to serve in the military and was asked to serve his country which he did honorably. Unfortunately he paid the ultimate price and I'm sure that he believed he was doing the right thing. Your spectacle at the State of the Union was totally uncalled for. If you were given a ticket and an invite to attend, why would you taunt everyone with such a deplorable shirt. Knowing what you have done for press coverage in the past, I'm sure that there is more to the story than what you are trying to lead everyone to believe. Whether you agree to disagree with the current administrations actions, the State of the Union was not the place to display your radical leftist ideology.

I am very confused about something that maybe someone in here could help me with. Ms. Sheehan referred to the People's State of the Union Address. Is this the proper name or is it the State of the Union Address? I was under the impression that this was for the President to address congress, but it is also open for the Public to hear what he has to say. I believe that if this is in fact for the president to address congress, then there should not be any "protesting" allowed, however if it is in fact the People's State of the Union Address then I believe that her rights may have been violated. Any help?

Cindy Sheehan ought to sue these officials directly. What a shame it is when the cause of freedom turns out to be false rhetoric. I have never been so ashamed or disgusted to be an American. When will America wake up? I am tired of this and deep down know that the negative and greedy acts of America have come home to roost. Thanks a lot.

oh so bushite. I presume he reads the statement, "we, the people of the American goverment..." as the royal we--me, myself and I.

he does have a way of making himself incredibly unpopular--

just think if any one of those firebrand forefathers had been there to protest-- or George Washington himself. He wasn't particularly fond of foreign entanglements either. "Sorry, old man, we can't have protestoprs in here with powdered wigs. Gotta maintain the decorum, ya know."

since when is taking off a jacket a crime? paranoia rules.

I prefer the first amendment myself. I am sure Bush would do away with the Constitution if he thought he could get away with it. It would be far easier to staff factories and corporations with cheap labor if the citizens of this country lost their rights. The military industrial complex is behind his agenda. There will be no peace with leaders that are funded by war machines. I would beg my fellow Americans not to elevt another scoundrel, but with black box voting machines (created by Bush supporters) and a smarmy electoral college- who are we kidding? We might as well let Bush hand pick his successors.

Apparently, Sheehan has decided that 15 minutes of fame isn't enough, and wants to try for 16.

Shees, that anyone can see her as anything but a lunatic is beyond me.

How she can disgrace her son in such a manner is truly das.

Earth to Cindy, come back please.

The state of our union is strong? Really? The state of President Bush’s union may be strong, but for the average American, the union is anything but strong. This is evidenced by the actions experienced by Cindy Sheehan and Representative Young’s wife Beverly. It amazes me how this administration censors dissenting opinion. Often times the President is insulated from this type of dissent by surrounding himself with well groomed crowds. Is he really afraid to hear the voice of the people over that of the corporation? When he spoke at Kansas State, in defense of the “domestic spying program,” he was confronted by a student that asked how cutting $12.7 billion from student loans was supposed to help the education of students. Seemingly disoriented and confused, he managed to spew some talking points that really didn’t answer the question. Maybe that is what he is afraid of. Perhaps he really doesn’t have answers to his critics, unless prepared ahead of time; therefore he has them removed so they don’t pose a problem. It must be a lovely world in which he lives. When will it be our turn?

The first point I would like to make is that Ms. Sheehan is incorrect in citing that the it is the Peoples State of the Union address. It is not, it is the Presidents address to Congress. It is not her platform for communicating her view.
Second, my condolence to her on her loss. Her son served and made a choice. He raised his right hand and said that he would obey the orders of the President of the U.S. and officers appointed over him. Her son made a choice, if she didn't agree with that she could have expressed her opinion to her son prior to him joining the military. Again her son made a choice, we are a volunteer Army. Soldiers join this military knowing, now more than ever, that they may go to war and God forbid, die. Her son made a choice, if she didn't like it she should reflect on her abilities as a parent and the influences she placed in his life. She should bring into question herself, and what kind of mother she was prior to him joining the military. Many young men join the Army to get away from home. She should reflect on how much time she invested in his life and how much time she flitted away. How much time she spent in front of a TV or shopping, she is obviously a very selfish person. It's all about her. She had time with him before he joined the military and could have fostered a home and life that he wouldn't want to leave. She could have given sound advice that he listened to if he respected her. I'm sure she would have advised him not to join the military. Unfortunately Cindy Sheehan has fallen prey to what most of America has as well. We spend as little time as possible with our children, we let cartoons babysit them. When they turn 5 they go off to school, and the time we spend decreases even more. Peer influence begins to override family values. The parent begins to care less and less and when the child turns 18 the parent can't wait for them to leave so the parent can do what they have been waiting 18 years for. Young men and women join the military, often not knowing what they are getting into, they just want to get away. Some like it and stay and others leave.
Now Ms. Sheehan wants to parade, let her start with herself and do some reflection, did she fall prey to the above mentioned comments, or did she foster an environment where her son wanted to stay. A good honest time of self reflection on how she spent the time with her son prior to joining the military is what Ms. Sheehan needs.
Ms. Sheehan has gotten caught up in being a celeb and garnering attention from politicians who use her for their own agendas. I feel bad that she is dishonoring her son's sacrafice and using it for personal gain.

I was in the chamber when Ms. sheehan was removed. She was being very hostile with security, she even tried to spit on the security guard, she is lying about what took place. One bit of advice, take a bath and put on some make-up before you go to court.

Wow! This whole thread blows my mind that there are people that really hate and think that they have the right to speak, write, or wear anything they want, when or were ever they want. I guess you can, but people will stop listening to you like the boy who cried wolf. I pity Cindy Sheehan. If you like Chavez and hate Bush, move to Venezuela, for the next two years.

theTRUTHtheLIGHT – Do you actually believe that? This country really is screwed up. Do you have a job? Or do you just hope that other people will work hard and support you? Free health care and free education equals worthless healthcare and worthless education. Let’s make everybody a winner equals everyone’s a loser.

Stan - A leader who is elected represents the view of the majority, and for those four years those view win. That is democracy. One side wins the other side loses. The problem is that one side is O.K. with losing and waits our turn to try again, but the other side whines and cries that where they won or not should have anything to do with how the view of the government are. I think you understand.

J. Arrigo – Amen, but no one will see it that way. They hate Bush and everybody that voted for him. Funny how they hate, haters isn’t it.

theTRUTHtheLIGHT – You really need to move to Venezuela. I think you would like it there.

just steve – Lazy press isn’t the governments fault. Quit thinking that it is. But you hate Bush, so every road leads to Bush. Hater.

L.M. – We don’t let crazy people near normal people, sorry Cindy.

martin aller-stead – You really think President Bush should go to every soldier’s funeral, as much as this might hurt, he is the most Power full man in the world and he has more important things to do. Of course you are going to say “what is more important than the men and women who have died for our country?” And I say, “The people they died for!” You, me, our children, the Afghan people, the Iraqi people. They are more important because the soldiers died for them.
Cindy Sheehan needs to go home, fix her marriage. Isn’t she mad at Bush for Lying to our country, didn’t she lie to her ex-husband, “death do us part” I do, she isn’t dead yet is she.

People will in the end see President Bush was a great president. Look at Abe Lincoln, during his Presidency people thought he was a horrible president, and now after 150 years we look and say he was one of the best. Cindy Sheehan will be forgotten, but her sons sacrifice will never be.

In every age there are a few who stand up (for the rest of us)and say that what we are tolerating isn't right. Often they lack the polish and the experience of those who know how to look wise in the public eye. What they have instead is the passion that has been cowed out of the rest of their contempoaries. While we need them to speak out, to add perspective and leadership, we often ridicule them, even vilify them.

Then of course years later we celebrate them. It has always seemed so. "You worship at he tombs of the prophets that you had killed."

What an interesting race of creatures we are. How difficult our fear makes our social evolution. In ten years, I predict we will celebrate Cindy Sheehan as one of the forebears who helped us get past another armed debacle. Some day we will learn to settle our disputes in a truly "civilized" way.

Cindy Sheehan got the charges dropped, but the damage is done and will continue!
Anyone who has studied Fascism knows that it doesn't happen overnight. There typically is a ratcheting down on things like civil liberties, freedom of speech, dissenting opinions and a ratcheting UP of things like corporate and religious control merging with government. We are undoubtedly on the way there and it IS happening whether you want to admit it or not.
An alarming percentage of "decent" Americans seem to be OK with this! It CAN happen here. It IS happening.
Borrowing a coal mining reference: The canaries are dying all around us while the fat pigs play happliy in the mud(money).

J. Arrigo is the only one who got it right. She broke a law and got arrested. Stop blaming it on "Bush and his cronies" and do something about it. Petition your congressman and change the law. Or run for congress if the mood suits you. Or as a last alternative, shut up and let more useful bits of data travel freely through the net.

If you REALLY REALLY REALLY need to blame someone, the only logical recipient would be the people who wrote that law.

by the way, i fell off my roof the other day. you know who's fault it was? gw

As for Republican Congressman Bill Young's wife, today's Washington Post reported the following:

"Young said he wouldn't be so mad if it were just Sheehan. "I totally disagree with everything she stands for," he said. But by removing his wife, Gainer's officers clearly "acted precipitously," Young said."

There's the difference right there. It's okay for HIS wife to wear a tshirt because he agrees with what her tshirt said, but it's NOT okay for Sheehan to show an opposing point of view on her tshirt.

And no, Young's wife was neither cuffed nor roughly handled according to all reports. So I dont see that the two women were treated the same.

Cindy Sheehan is upset because her son Casey chose to RETURN to Iraq and not stay at home with her as her mama's boy??

Casey, I'm sure, would be embarassed by all this. Isn't it curious that she isn't rejoicing that she has other children alive and well in this world? Get among the living, lady!!

Why won't the press find out what Mr. Sheehan's opinion is? Because he's a man and understands a son's chosen professional to proudly defend his nation?

It was Casey's choice to go - TWICE. Leave it alone.

Sue the hell out of them Cindy, one by one our rights are being taken away from us and handed over to the mega corporations of this country. Here’s a very important question! Why is Iraq in the shape it is in today?
Bruce Hillberry
ImSuing.com

This woman is as brave as the soldiers that have been ordered over to Iraq. What is the point of fighting a war in the name of protecting democracy and liberty only to deny these freedoms back home in Washington. Why is the most powerful man in the world scared of a brave little lady wearing a T-Shirt that no judge in any land would call offensive. This is just like Britain where the 82yr old Walter Wolfgang was arrested and physically dragged away in similar circumstances for terrorism offences simply for calling Tony Blair's justification for also being in Iraq as "Nonsense".

I almost believe little Miss Sheehan. Unfortunately since she is only after press and political leverage...she is sueing over something as meaningless as this....her credibility is zilch. This speaks volumes on her true intent and character. This is infantile behavior in its purest form.

She is a meaningless little slog of no consequence. Once the press finally figures this out then people may start taking things that the press says truly seriously.

Until that day good luck.

I AM DAMNED MAD!! Of course I have been damned mad for some time about the affairs of this administration. It still surprises me how Bush can get into so much trouble and give a speech and all these people accept his words that don't have all the facts included, are downright lies, and doesn't match all the misery we can see he has caused around us, such as lost insurance, high gas, lost jobs, lost sons and daughters,and I can just go on and on. Imagine all the stress and depression on individuals he has caused. I bet a few suicides are because of him. Cindy keep up the struggle. I haven't lost any sons or daughters but I AM DAMNED MAD!! I admire you for all you have gone through. All of it is a total shame. The Republicans must lose the majority in congress in 2006 so we can get on with the business at hand.

Sue the hell out of them Cindy, one by one our rights are being taken away from us and handed over to the mega corporations of this country. Here’s a very important question! Why is Iraq in the shape it is in today?
Bruce Hillberry
ImSuing.com

Cindy Sheehan has been the lightening rod for those of us who find this war not only horrifying but illegal as well.

I was not surprised to find her thrown out of the capital. Everyone had been informed she was there. The President was hell bent on putting on a terrific dog and pony show to jack up his ratings and the last thing he wanted would be the cameras looking into the balcony at his nemesis.

Given the length this administration will go to usurp civil rights does any of this suprise us?

I wonder, if Bush has 39% approval, what is his approval rating without THE SOUTH.

15% ?

10% ?

What a pathetic monkey... I am ashamed and saddened for the country I love.

Sheehan is a traitor to this country. She is the Tokyo Rose of our times. She has dishonored her Son, the US Militray and the United States. We've had enough of her and her liberal idiotic ideas. Please advice her to get mental help.

Martin-

No one would tolerate listening to her for very long. Her voice sounds like someone scratching a chalkboard

Stan:

Although Venezula's papers are still state owned, the first thing he did after coming into power was to grant freedom of the press. Maybe you'll be happy to know that Chavez takes *more* flak in his own country than bush takes here.

Let's get one thing straight for everyone that wants to blame "Bush's gestapo" for arresting Cindy Sheehan, like that ignorant congressman from CA said. The Capitol police are under the authority of the Congress, not the President.

Cindy Sheehan has turned into an embarrassment in my opinion. I will never be able to understand her pain of losing a son, but I sympathize with her and feel sorry for her loss. When she was protesting the war, I understood why. But now in my opinion, she is doing nothing to "honor" her son, it is all about Cindy Sheehan. She is totally in it for herself.

She makes embarrasing statements, ignorant statements, and overall makes the loony left look more loony. She compared Bush to Osama Bin Laden and said he was worse. Think you will hear that again in a campaign commercial? The left will rue the day they gave her power.

She shouldn't have been arrested, but I don't blame them for making her leave. The SOTU speech is not the place to make a statement, regardless of which party's president is speaking. And was she really roughed up? Or was that a half-truth to gain sympathy? Because I have seen pictures of her being escorted out, and the officer escorting her out, has his hand underneath her arm, he isn't grabbing it.

If the President is Constitutionally obligated to report the State of the Union, why does that speech not have to be a true measure of facts and not the twisted picture that is painted by the adminitration? I refer to (President selective in worldview) printed in this blog 2/1/2006

This administration is the most secretive, the most represive and the most incompetent administation in the history of out country. The founding fathers who fought for our freedom in the 1700's must be crying.

I can not believe that Cindy Sheehan continues to receive press coverage. The Marine Corps stands for Honor, Courage and Commitment all of which Casey fought for. Marines have been fighting for over two hundred years to protect the people of this great country as well as preserve the freedoms that we all enjoy. The very freedoms that Mrs. Sheehan is certainly entitled to. However, I can not belive that her continued public displays honor any of the fallen Marines or Soldiers in Iraq, Afghanistan or of wars past. My brother is in the Marine Corps and I can not possibly know the depth of my sorrow if I were to lose him but what I do know is that I would honor his sacrifice with dignity. I am forever grateful for the men and women that are willing to give all for this country. I am also assured that providence has provided us a Commander in Chief with commitment to do the right thing even when it is the most difficult and I belive that history will clearly tell the story. God Bless the USA.

Unfortunately, the travesty of forcefully hauling Cindy Sheenan out of the State of the Union Address is a poignant manifestation of a famous Socratic paradox – ‘To do injustice is the greatest of all evils’ --- for it’s better to suffer evil than commit it. While some 2,500 years ago Plato cautioned fellow citizens accordingly, today the long held notion that an injustice to one is an injustice to all is lost on many of those charged with public leadership. It's just that simple.

Sadly, welcome to a diminishing mindset in this country. Yet, was it not against that basic injustice our democracy aims to protect the minority from the tyranny of the majority? Seemingly, the zealots among us are increasingly failing to recognize that salient principle, while ironically, having been granted a free reign to do so with impunity against the majority from their minority position. I dread imagine what our future world shall be like if we continue to rest on our laurels and acquiesce to neo-conservative diatribes and attitudes becoming the majority position.

In closing, I’m reminded of the relevance of the nineteen century argument by John Stuart Mill in The Contest in America, “As long as justice and injustice have not terminated their ever renewing fight for ascendancy in the affairs of mankind, human beings must be willing, when need is, to do battle for the one against the other.” Press on Cindy Sheehan you’ve emerged as a vitally necessary public conscience for our increasingly misguided country.

For all those who say they wish Hugo Chavez was our president, I suggest you google Human Rights Hugo Chavez and read the results. Then pack up your stuff and move to Venezuela.

America is the best country to live in, PERIOD. Wwe have the most freedoms and we are the most successful economy in the world. You might not like the President, but it is amazing how so many of you justify everything you dislike that happens as the President's fault. Get over your idiocy.

If you want free healthcare, go move to Venezuela, because we don't want it here. Free healthcare isn't free. Before you post more ignorant statements here, please go take an Economics 101 course. Then please, do move to Venezuela, and see how much better it is. You'll be back in 6 months. Lemmings.

Well put Mr Arrigo, but the problem is that the powers that be have relegated the places in which you can legally protest in DC to the size of a postage stamp. Protesters aren't able to get anywhere near an official event featuring the President where cameras and an audience will be. In a country of 3,537,441 square miles and saturated with media and commercial and big political interests all clammoring for the attention of the American People with their massive advertising and PR funds, where are the common people, the grassroots to go? So fine, give him the State of the Union to "report" to Congress (perhaps the lawsuit should be with regard to the accuracy of this constitutionally required report?) but the People, all of the People need a place to speak and be heard.

TRUTHtheLIGHT. .
Apparently for you, you ready only what you have been programmed to see and believe anything that is anti-Bush. Even by your own postings, your quick to support socialist and liberal media while its a well posted fact that 95% of the articles are spun so far left, they come back for a reach around.

As for the supposed E-mail from Cindy, even that has the twist to it. From the picture I've seen as she's being led out, a few questions pop up.

She is being led out by her right arm, with a smile on her face. Hmmmm arms behind her back roughly. And yes this is a picture you can TELL she is being led UP stairs. Even in the "E-mail" posted above, she says quote:

"On the way out, someone behind me said, "That's Cindy Sheehan." At which point the officer who arrested me said: "Take these steps slowly." I said, "You didn't care about being careful when you were dragging me up the other steps."

Dragged up the steps. Think about that one.

"I wish Chavez was the president of the United States. At least we would all get free healthcare and education. "

How about you work for you education/health care and quit expecting the free ride, on the backs of us people who actually work for our living.

Remember, when you point the finger at others, how many of your own are pointed back at you?

I agree that Cindy should sue and I can't wait to read about how Beverly Young was removed from the State of the Union. I too would agree with L.M. about the stark difference between how the two women were removed. Until we get the facts, I will hold my judgement.

It is shameful that the relationship between the People and its representatives have been turned upside down. When did those we elect get the gumption to supercede our Constitutional rights? Loaded question? YOU BET! Whether its wearing a tee-shirt or wiretapping or unjustly holding American's who affiliate with protest groups, one thing is clear. This administration is quite successful at not only intimidation, but outrightly flaunts their bravado (as in the case with the President's 'right' to wiretap without a warrent). We all need to stand up, question our government's action, and be real Patriots by defending our Bill of Rights and the Constitution of the US by removing those who not only abuse the powers afforded them by you and me, but use fear and propoganda to advance their neo-conservative agenda.

Finally I would add that Stan does need to get his facts straight. I recommend he view the documentary called "The Revolution Will Not Be Televised", which captured the coup attempt against Hugo Chavez as it was happening. The documentary clearly demonstrates that Chavez's opponents used the country's 4 media outlets to subvert and defame the democratically elected President. Chavez's reaction wasn't to close down those TV stations even though on the evening news the anchor said that Chavez and Castro were homosexual lovers. And Stan, you cry about state-run media...In fact the creation of a state-run TV station was a response to the 4 private TV stations that were blasting anti-Chavez propoganda everyday. Those 4 privately run TV stations still exist and their rights have not been curtailed and if anything, Chavez has used the judiciary and the legislature to rein in the ability of these propogandists from defamation of character through outright lies. That is the myth propogaged by this administration and the lemmings we call US corporate media.

I invite any and all comments and responses...We must all stand up and remind those in power that they are only there because WE ALLOW IT...too many American's have forgotten this very important point.

PEACE,

BOOYAH

J. Arrigo has it right; if you claim the right of protest is absolute (anywhere, anytime), say goodbye to doing any kind of meaningful activity - including the business of the country.

The nice thing about America is, you see, if you don't like Fox News, you can always watch CNN. Or you can start your own news organization. Perhaps Mr. Chavez will provide the seed money.

God bless you Cindy Sheehan!!!! When will Rummy and his killers get enough? Maybe when the body count is as high as Vietnam!!!

Cindy you have my regrets and sympathies. I regret letting Bushmanure take over the country. I voted against him and tried to tell my family but they would not listen. I see now that I have to do more. Where can I get the latest update on the killings in Iraq? It is still the wrong war, at the wrong time, in the wrong place as it was when Sen. Kerry was trying to rouse the country. Maybe now people will begin to think about impeachment for the current resident of the White House for breaking the law.

Cindy sweetheart, I feel bad you got hot and had to take your jacket off at the state of the union speech. Isn't it an amazing coincidence you were wearing that inflamatory T-shirt? or do you just not change clothes anymore?
I know you're used to living in a camp but Cindy, honey. It's time to get a change of clothes sweety. And a life.

Cindy Sheehan is missing the whole point. Her son WANTED to go and fight in Iraq, he WANTED to make a difference in the lives of oppressed people, and he WANTED to stand up for democracy for people everywhere. Her son, in the next world, must be now turning his head in shame and hoping that his mother will HONOR his personal sacrifice that he made of his OWN FREE WILL. I have five sons, and have lost one of those to death, though not in war. If my son died fighting for a good cause that he believed in I would certainly grieve but hope I would not behave in such a disgraceful fashion. Message for Cindy: mothers of the world grieve for you, but don't become bitter...become better.

Cindy sweetheart, I feel bad you got hot and had to take your jacket off at the state of the union speech. Isn't it an amazing coincidence you were wearing that inflamatory T-shirt? or do you just not change clothes anymore?
I know you're used to living in a camp but Cindy, honey. It's time to get a change of clothes sweety. And a life.

To the person that wrote about all the story that Venezeula report on. The is a stupid point, of course Venezeula papers are allowed to report negetive things on USA. It is Chavez that they are not allowed to write negetive stuff on. I find that Cindy Sheehan is demagogue. Cindy obsesion destory her marriage and family. When the other family release a statement about Casey being a hero and in support of the war. Cindy and her sister question their relationship and love of Casey. Cindy Sheehan feeling are all that matter to her. Cindy says that she won't go on Bill O'Rielly any more (I don't watch him or am a fan) because he treated her so badly but expect the Prestent to meet with her after the way she treat him. Cindy say she is not a tratior the enemy. Chavez stood next to the Venezuela President as he chanted Death to America's empire. The has been no draft in this war Casey sign up for the army. I know not everyone supports this war the only war but most don't support pulling out right now also.

Now hearing the true account from Ms. Sheehan I wonder and question the rights and authority of this administration. Who are these people? ...They cannot be Americans.

To Mrs. Sheehan and others I say - keep fighting and you will one day help return this country to what it used to be known for.

Freedom.

We are proud of you, Cindy. And we love you. Please keep your chin up, and keep up the stuggle. Bush is truly evil. Best wished to you.

The Corporate press is not "free". It costs about $3.00 for a newspaper on Sunday, in addition, the corporate press collects huge amounts of money in advertising.

What is seems to be "free" about the press today isa that they selectively suppress or print stories based on the corporate buy-line.

I don't buy newspapers or their corporate bull, or take their advertisers advice to the market.

I, like Ms. Sheehan feel we have lost what America stands for, but on the other hand, I think we never really had it. Especially since world wars I & II.

I think the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution put forth IDEAS that when put into practice result in a just and peaceful government. What we have today is the shadow of despotism - King George is no longer on foreign shores - he is sitting in the White House!

Obviously nobody is entirely correct or incorrect on this issue or any other, though you would like to believe so. I notice discrepencies in both parties and both are just as stupid as the other.

I see that its natural to want YOUR view to be accepted as correct but you know as well as I that everybody wants this. Who ever is in power, be it the president, majority/minority leaders, lobbyist group leaderes, CEOs of large corporations, media groups, or even a grieving mother who makes herself noticed via television and newspaper by way of some almost egregious acts, you can rest assured that they have a huge area of leverage on injecting their views into the public. Unfortunately everybody is gullable when it comes to something they WANT to here. I literally HEAR too many people saying this and that about what they heard.......well, "heard" isnt really fact is it?

Moral of the story is, dont believe what you hear or read, unless you were there to witness it with your own eyes and hear it with your own ears, and able to undoubtedly compare it FACT FOR FACT to ascertain the truth.

Sincerely,
A citizen that is not brainwashed by any party or any policially charged media from the left or the right

Yet another example of a basic truth: The dream that was America is dead.

Just sent to March Sandoval, Washington Bureau Chief for the San Francisco Chronical.

From: stephen@ddleague-usa.net
To: msandalow@sfchronicle.com
Cc: DDL Discussion List ; Michael Boldin ; Helen Schmidt ; WAMM -- Val & Mike Corral ; Richard Reeves ; Rep John Conyers ; Mike Ruppert ; Jim & Art Cullen ; Freedom Forum ; Carol Brouillet ; Bev Conover ; Anthony Coughlan
Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 9:05 AM
Subject: A Million Little Fascist Pieces

Re -- "2 ejections from House denounced -- Capitol police chief apologizes to GI's mom, lawmaker's wife", by Marc Sandalow, Washington Bureau Chief for the San Francisco Chronicle, 02 Feb 2006.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/02/02/MNGRAH1IF21.DTL

"We're very sorry, Cindy Sheehan, for violating your constitutional right to free speech at the SOTU. Now that our fascist values of zeo offense to Bush The Great are safe again from scum like you, you're free to go. But now you and your friends know what will happen the next time you pull this sxxx."

It's just another of the million little fascist pieces of anti-rights, anti-freedoms, and anti-liberties in the Bush-Cheney Illegitimacy. We won't forget. The come-uppance will be massive. Impeachment and removal will be only the beginning. Prosecutions under the 1945 federal statute, 18 USC 241 -- criminal conspiracy against citizen rights -- will fine and imprison thousands of the anti-American fascist thugs having their day in the Bush-Cheney sun now.

Stephen Neitzke
Tulsa, OK
Direct Democracy League
http://ddleague-usa.net

Do a search for Cindy Sheehan and David Duke. I'm sure your opinions of her will change drastically. She's not who you think she is.

I just want to understand why Ms. Sheehan's loss is any greater than those suffered by other parents of deceased veterans, in this war or any previous. Should all of those who lost lives in Somalia get to make their own "State of the Union" address, too, as Martin has suggested? What about for all of our troops under UN or NATO control? Those we lost during the operations in the former Yugoslavia? What about Korea or Vietnam? WWII?

By the way - For those not old enough to remember, we put our head in the sand when the Axis powers attacked in Europe and the Pacific, until they bombed Pearl Harbor. By then, the enemy had strengthened so much that it cost us many more lives than it would have if we had gone into Europe when the Nazis first took Poland. Instead, we said it's Europe's problem. We cannot afford such complacency again. There is no such thing as freedom without a price to be paid. And if you don't want to make the sacrifice of fighting in these battles, don't join the armed forces. It's not as if Ms. Sheehan's son was plucked from the civilian ranks and forced to become a soldier. That does not make his death any less tragic, but he knew he might be called to sacrifice for our country's security. But we cannot afford to wait for countries who harbor and compensate terrorists to strike first. And that's what Hussein was known for doing ($25,000 to the family of each successful Palestinian bomber).

I have nothing to offer Ms. Sheehan, and the thousands of other family members, other than my deepest, most sincere apologies about the tragic loss of their loved ones. But I know that their sacrifice over the last 3 years was part of fighting a battle now that may end up saving hundreds of thousands of American lives in the future. With the deposing of the Taliban, Saddam's removal, and Libya's subsequent disarming of WMD, I know my children will live in a safer world because of the sacrifice of these soldiers. I just wish I felt better about our exit strategy in the Iraq theatre right now.

It is a sad fact that a place that holds decorum in such regards would treat anyone with a ticket to attend with less respect than it would the President of the United States. None of this would have been a matter worth reporting had a security officer calmly attended to Mrs. Sheehan and requested that she put her jacket back on, zip it up and leave it up for the remainder of the presentation, or even asked her to come with them in a civilized manner. Why they would feel the need to manhandle anyone in this forum with such disgrace says a great deal about lack of respect these officers have for the American public in a house built by us and for us. The speaker and the message are mute based on the handling of this matter prior to the beginning of the address.

While several people make valid points, I would counter some of them with the fact that even in this forum, we can find legitimate arguments on the subject and therefore there is room for this subject to be argued in a court of law. No matter what your views on the President or the job they are doing for us, Mrs. Sheehan has never in what I have seen, witnessed or heard has ever been pushy and anything less than respectful with her protest. The officers owed her the same respect they demand from us. You may despise my stance on a subject matter, but do not loose respect for the fact that I have the right to a difference in opinion.

Our President needs to learn that lesson. Mr. Bush has had many opportunities to disarm Mrs. Sheehan’s protest. When she was visible outside his ranch in Texas, a good Southern Gentleman would have gone to speak with her. They may differ on the subject matter, but that is OK. Once he spoke with her, he could have simply held a brief news conference with Mrs. Sheehan declaring his increased sympathies for her and his great understanding for her position, but that he respectfully differs with her opinions. This may not have ended her protest, but he would have looked like the gentleman our President needs to be, but also like a good leader the world expects of the greatest nation in the world. The fact that he refuses still to this day to meet with anyone who has a difference of opinion with him makes him and the great office he holds look sad and mocks the principles this country and his position was created to uphold. If our President cannot accept criticism from someone in a closed door meeting, it is a wonder that the police and staff treated Mrs. Sheehan with such disgrace and disgust. What they cannot see is that they themselves are giving more credibility to Mrs. Sheehan and her protest than her own cause does.

Mrs. Sheehan, keep fighting the good fight. Sometimes a revolution is just what we need for great things to happen. My hopes and prayers are with you as you move forward and as the Great Martin Luther King pointed out, never loose respect for your stance, your opponent and always do so with non-violence. When your oppressors use tactics such as the ones used to eject you; you remain a bastion of hope and support for even more people who can find pride in what you do.

Yours truly,

T-InAtlanta

The state of our union is dreadful--and it seems on a downward spiral under the Present Resident's not-very-watchful hand. Hijinks like Ms. Sheehan's very public expulsion and Mr. Bush's recent outright lies to citizens about budget cuts in education demonstrate his lack of character and our lack of inquisitiveness.

I look forward to the day when the U.S. elects a President, so that we can resume diplomatic relations with the world, regain some of the respect this Administration has lost for us, and finally pay some attention to the American people who are *not* wealthy and well-placed. It may be that we can, within a decade, actually clean up some of the mess that Mr. Bush is still creating.

Though some would disagree, civil liberties are crucial to our continuation as a sovereign nation. We need to recover, if possible, some of that self-respect that we used to have in abundance, before the Patriot Act and the many rubber-stamping members of the Congress degraded it--and the nation.

The state of our union can still be improved, but it will need an immediate and continual display of backbone on the part of every American who loves actual freedom, not the shadowy variety espoused by Mr. Bush and Co.

Stan,

It is true that Venezuela has imposed additional rules that imposes requirements on the press, e.g. carrying 60 minutes of government programming on a day-to-day basis. While such rules are deplorable it is not like you suggest, that every newspaper is owned by the state. Here is what Human Rights Watch had said about Venezuela and Chavez: "Until now, the Chávez government has largely respected press freedom even in the face of a strident and well-resourced opposition press. Indeed, as part of the often heated and acrimonious debate between supporters of the government and its opponents, the press has been able to express strong views without restriction. Private television companies have often adopted a blatantly partisan position, and their news and debate programs have been extremely hostile to the Chávez government."

I wish people would quit giving this crazy woman the coverage that she wants.

I think that it is a tragedy that Ms. Sheehan was removed from the building and especially tragic the manner in which she was removed. So now, not only are the presses censored, but, OUR congressmen/congresswomen can only hear from other government officials. Hmmm... I thought I remembered something about government for the people BY the people..... hmmm It seems that instead of Ms. Sheehan being ejected, all the members of congress should have been wearing the same shirts asking Mr. Bush the same question that Ms. Sheehan was asking, in OUR name as OUR elected officials.
As to the statement "governments, including the federal government, may place reasonable restrictions as to time, place and manner upon otherwise protected speech", what's next. Will the government be able to determine what is an acceptable free speech (i.e. it's content)...... Hmmm And we say that free speech is suppressed in Mr. Chavez's country..... Hmmmm
And we don't want to go into illegal wire tapping, and other freedoms guaranteed in our constitution being redefined to fit the mold.... Are we free...???

What's sauce for the goose is not always the same sauce apparently. While Europe has stirred up its own hornet's nest with some Danish, French and German newspapers publishing cartoons of Prophet Mohammed, stout defenders stand up for the right to freedom of expression. I don't see any editors or cartoonists being arrested for this act, well as they should not be. And yet, here at home, we have a caricature of a president afraid to hear a single dissenting voice, on a t-shirt, far less than a mass media vehicle, and far less derogatory in its content than the "free speech" that some Europeans are indulging in.

If you people like Hugo Chavez so much then move to Venezuela. Honestly people do you think you would get away with what you are saying with Chavez as president? There is no way. you people are unreal....Seeing Sheehan arm in arm with Chavez makes me sick as do you people. Love it or leave.

Cindy new precisely what she was doing, as did Lynn Woolsey when she gave Cindy the ticket.

She doesn't seem to know that she being used as a pawn in a political game.

Here's some basic commonsense:
Don't make controversial statements while attending the President's State of the Union address. You'll get kicked out. It's not an environment that is conducive to that sort of business - no matter what you stand for. Cindy seems either hopelessly confused or misguided by those influencing her.

I personally think all you above bloggers have your collective heads up the same butt - trying to giving George an enema of one sort or another. Mostly because all I see in your postings is agenda ... agenda ... agenda ... I'm an independent but voted for Mr. Bush both times, the second because I thought his para-religious zeal in responding to the muslim extremists was the better motive. I still believe so, even tho many of his party's other agenda items are very contrary to my personal beliefs.

However you do no justice to Cindy's apparent clarification. Taken at it's face value, which is all it's worth, Cindy was ejected and jailed for just attending a meeting. Which in fact someone had to pay (probably a substantial amount) to attend, what ever the motive. The fact that she may have been wearing clothing some may have deemed politically incorrect for the occasion is irrelevant (how can you be politically incorrect at a politically motivated assembly which included the most divisive set of politically motivated representatives, our congress? You think Kennedy, as well as many others, wasn't wearing that shirt in his heart-of-hearts? If disruption was the real intent, I wouldn't have announced it so passively!)

Bush was wrong! There were many protestors there. But they were passive, as was Cindy apparently. Had she shown disruptive intent to protest what happened to her was acceptable. Cindy should get her money back, and an apology from Mr. Bush. Can't take back the jail time.

I don't agree with Cindy's politics, but she deserves the same respect as anyone else at the assembly until she becomes actively disruptive.

Re: post by stan | Feb 1, 2006 3:02:50 PM

Your comments remind me of time spent in the early 80's in the old Soviet Union. When I returned everybody talked about those "poor Russians" who have no idea of what's going on in the world due to censorship.

Despite a state-controlled news services, the Soviet was was better informed on the world than his american counterpart. The Soviet had a suspicion of what he read or heard in the news and using his "prism-of-distrust" he could discern the truth. I noted, at the time, that it was the American who was ill-equiped to know what was going on in the world.

The American is mostly ignorent to the world due to our blind trust in the government. The American also fails to recognize that there is very little independent-of-the-government reporting (Spent 15 years in reporting, several years at a network level). And, I know it's easy to pick on them, but easily the least-informed of them all is the Fox viewer.

Might it be that taking a Republican congressman's wife out of the State of the Union speech, at the same time Cindy Sheehan was removed, is a gambit out of the Karl Rove dirty tricks play book?

It was known that Cindy would be at the talk, which would obviously bother our democracy-loving administration. Taking her out would be sure to raise a ruckus. So--great idea--get a Republican--preferably a woman--to wear a shirt supporting the President's policies and make her leave, thus making everything "even handed."

Interestingly enough, Mrs. Young wasn't grabbed, put in handcuffs and arrested.

Brilliant!

Stan:
How do you know that Venezuela's press is controlled by the government? Because you read about it in a US government controlled paper? It seems that Fox News is on Venezuela's TV. So is the US government's Voice of America, and CNN. Are you trying to say that these government and corporate news organizations don't tell us the truth? What do you know that I don't?

"Of the People, By the People, for the Corporations"

Thank god we still have our freedoms, like freedom to pursue life, liberty and happiness. I'm alive (paycheck to paycheck), i have the liberty to talk to my european friends (while the NSA taps my conversaiton without a warrant) and I am so happy that my peers are dying in a foreign country, in a war we may need but corporations act like it's a feeding frenzy to expand thier domains (haliburton anyone?). *if you don't see the dripping sarcasm, get your coat on the way out*

I say our foreign policy has overshadowed our domestic policy for too long. Let's make sure our shores are safe and free before we expand our reach into third world countries, who really would rather live thier own lives thier own way. After hundreds of years, advances in technology, etc, we still have our own starving children, homeless in the streets and domestic programs that need revamping.

I applaud sheehan for standing up amongst the crowd of cattle and not mooing the same tune with the rest. Fight on.

It has been verified that there was another arrest and it was for wearing a t-shirt that supported our troops, GOLD BLESS AMERICA..... Cindy I hate you as much as you hate our president... but I dont go out very day telling people how much I hate you. oh and bye the way did someone twist your sons hand when he joined the military? He died for our country and for what we stand for..

If you dont like it hear LEAVE and dont come back.

It is truely disheartening that people can continue to support outlandish acts, such as that done to Ms. Sheehan. It is absurd to think that it's "OK" for the government to decide when and where one can express thier opinion, regardless of how many times its been done in the past or that a law exists to allow it. Wake up and think for yourself. Not all that is right is found in some law school book. Questioning laws and actions by your government does not make you unpatriotic, it makes them accountable! Without accountability we will live in Bushtopia. Ms. Sheenhan better sue, as a matter of fact we all should sue our rights are being laid to waste as I type this.

Mrs. Sheehan is correct. We have lost the country that we once had, a country where protestors did not get hauled out of the so-called "People's House" for their right of protesting. In the Bushie's terrible war for the profit from oil, in their paranoia criticism for getting caught in a lie of their own creation and trying to cover their tracks,in their lying and spying, in their beatings and tortures, in their suppression of the rights that they have sworn to uphold, they have taken us to new levels of hypocrisy. The United States has become little better than the dictatorship that we have spent so many lives trying to overthrow and re-make.

We have only ourselves to blame. We could have thrown him out. Now, the so-called greatest government in the world is flat-footed, unable to resist the oncoming tyranny. Cindy is about the only one really making noise about what has happened out there and what it is that we have lost. We will lose more until the people finally rise up against this corporate dictatorship. I saw this during the Civil Rights and Vietnam years. But, now, everyone except Cindy is so complacent.

I hope that she continues to do what she is doing and exposes the terrible lies of this administration and the GOP in general. She has paid the price for it. What have so many Americans, including a friend of mine, been sent to die for by a callous president that still wants to charge them for their care when they get back?

Thank God for Cindy Sheehan.

What happened to the days when you showed respect by showing up to an event like this dressed properly? In a suit. When did a T-shirt and zipper jacket become proper attire for presentation in front of congress, the TV and others?
Please stop the presses on Cindy and cover the strong military spouses! They are the people we should listening to!
As a proud military wife (who has had to endure 12 months without a husband SO FAR!) I would never disrespect my husband looking like that.

Cindy says "she sucked it up".. What? When did she suddenly become a wallflower? Cindy had a mission going in. And that was press coverage. She got it. Now please let's be done with her.

Cindy says she was "man handled". If you want to see tough. Talk to the hundreds of military spouses that are left behind to fend for themselves for months at a time. You don't know tough till you met a wife who can go 18 months without a husband and still hold everything together. Cindy is a wuz!

Once again this woman is being used by the far left bomb throwers....did anyone talk the wife of housemember that was removed as well? quite the spin i'd say. cindy is a very much out of touch needs to go away and stop making a fool of her self and shame to her brave son.

we are at war with people that will kill all of us ....what part of that do you not understand cindy?

sept 11, 2001...dec 7 1941 never forget.

barry allan

The upshot of the whole thing is that I can bring my great big banner to the State of the Union address next year and not get thrown out! Thank you, Ms. Sheehan and Ms. Young. Of course, no one will like what I have to say. GO STEELERS! or something like that. Around here that's political speech, trust me.
Seriously, it's all part of the devolution of the House and Senate toward something like the British House of Commons or the Jerry Springer Show. It's ood to restrict the FORM of speech in certain places, like a courtroom or a legislative chamber. This way opinions are heard and considered in an orderly fashion, giving each the weight it deserves. Whether I agree with Ms. Sheehan or Ms. Wright (or both!), I believe they should have left their t-shirts outside the House chamber and put them back on again after they left. Figuratively speaking, of course.

J. Arrigo completely missed the point. Yes, First Admendment freedom of speech is not absolute - but how it is dealt with is the issue here. Ms. Sheenan was not disruptive here. She could have been quitely asked to keep her jacket on or even quietly asked to leave... but she was RUFFED UP AND ARRESTED! This response by the staff is a direct reflection of how Bush deals with disent - and it is not the America I remember or want to live in.

As far as the claim to equal treatment of the Republican Congressman's wife - give me a break... she was asked to leave but was not arrested. Two completey different treatments for the same offense of improper dress based on the message. Where did America go??

This woman is a pure looney.

Its the President's State of the Union Address.
NOT
the "People's" (sic) STate ofthe Union Address.

The express Rules of Congress prohibit all advertising and promotion - including self promotion - and protest within the chambers.

Her comments do not ring true. IMO She is a self serving liar in her description of what happened and why.

She got what she deserved- she got tossed for violating the rules of the chamber.

She's a nut is what I think.

Too bad about her son though.

Cindy deserves to deliver a state of the union? , Chavez a "great leader with courage incredible intelligence and charisma" Chavez over Bush? Wow! What a crowd.

Chavez quoted as saying the U.S. deserved 9/11. Calling Saddam his "Brother" Alleged to give money to Al Queda. Arrests and murders of his political opposition. Having a personal militia to prevent a coup, ripping the U.S and Bush, and partnering with Iran. But hey....they have free healthcare! No wonder the left loves him so much.

I think Cindy Sheehan is great. I think the posters supporting her and Chavez are great. Keep it up and please try to make yourselves more visible. Try to get on TV and let common Americans hear your point of view. Please don't stop!

I agree with J Arrigo. Emotions aside, the arguments are amiss if centered around Bush. He did not institute an end to free speech. Would any other President have tolerated more? Was Sheehan invited only to be ejected?

This is simple "order" in a place set for the US and not merely one's emotinal expression of loss, though tragic, as any loss is emotionally.

Sheehan's views are represented by her constituents and her individually expressed opinion is being read all over the newspapers. Except, day by day she is losing credibility due to her emotionally charged "victimized" mentality.

America is still here, America is fighting for what matters. Freedom to all, and not just one! Chaos won't get you there!

The press has been so completely critical of the Bush Administration that you would have to believe President Bush is Satan incarnate to believe they haven't been rough enough on him, indeed, were he not a public official, he could sue for libel over the wholesale negative press he receives.
A memo to the liberals posting on this site, simply refuting the (intelligent) arguments of your ideological opponents by stating that they are "ignorant" or "can't read" is not intelligent debate, it is a sad testimony to the nature of debate in our society, but it is neither legitimate nor intelligent. You can claim as much as you wish that us "neocons", which I assume is a more evil conservative, are ignorant, illiterate, or lost, but the truth of the matter is that if we are evil for protecting freedoms around the world, refusing to submit to the immense danger of nationalized healthcare, and refusing to adopt a socio-political system that is not only a complete, total, and abject failure everywhere it is tried, than I and many others proudly claim to be neocons.
To the Sheehan issue, before her son was killed in Iraq inhibiting your right to get me killed by terrorism at home, she loudly and proudly proclaimed that anyone in Iraq fighting the terrorists deserved to die...
When did this change? It changed when her son died and she chose to dishonor her family (who have publicly stated support for her son and his mission, check it out online sometime) by attacking a president and a socio-economic system she clearly dispises.
Her son was among the many soldiers who have volunteered to defend this country, and stated how much the mission in Iraq meant to him, her mother distorts his ideals and dishonors his memory in attempt to weaken the United States and turn back the clock to a socialistic system that has long since been proven weak and moribund.

The state of the union address is an age-old tradition of the government. Those individuals invited to it should have the respect and common sense to dress appropriately. Ms. Sheehan claims she was undecided if she would attend or not, but "sucked it up and went" because the press had been told she would be attending. Perhaps she should have given less thought to disappointing the press and more thought to respectful attire? Then again, her attire guaranteed that the press paid plenty of attention to her. Perhaps she was not so undecided after all. I am very sorry for Ms. Sheehan’s loss. However I cannot help but wonder how her son would feel about her actions. It seems that the memory of his bravery and dedication has been overshadowed by his mother’s demonstrations. Does she really think that President Bush has sent our servicemen over there for no good reason? Surely she cannot be that unintelligent. Many women have lost sons and husbands in the war. My heart goes out to them. My respect also goes out to them. Particularly the women who have remembered there lost loved ones with respect and dignity.

What's become of our culture is at fault. No longer is there proper decorum in America. At Sunday church services, I see men in blue jeans; at funerals, women in slacks or brightly colored outfits; store clerks and waiters want to call me by my first name; telemarketers pester me on the Sabbath. I'm delighted when one of our institutions enforces their required decorum.

Ms. Sheehan was improperly dressed for the occasion of the 2006 State of the Union address - with or without the writing, it's still a tee shirt and not appropriate. Ms. Sheehan's informal references to the President of our United States as Bush or George Bush are also shameful. Whether or not I agree with her side of the issue and while I do have sympathy for her loss of a child, I consider her as a person to be a rather sorry lot.

Hey, Some one should help these two gals how to dress properly for a nite on the town. I wouldn't take either one wearing a T-Shirt. CZ

So I've read a number of articles on this affair by a few "right-leaning" commentators, and I'm struck by how it seems impossible for the right to mention Cindy Sheehan without also mentioning Hugo Chavez. To what purpose does this serve? What has Hugo Chavez got to do with wearing an anti-war t-shirt? Howcum nobody's made mention, say, that the vast majority of Congressman Bill Young's contributions come from defense contractors like BAE Systems? Certainly this bit of information is much more relevant to his wife's pro-war fashion choices, don't you think? It's time for the right to stop the McCarthyist rhetoric of "guilt by association" personal attacks, 'cause the majority of Americans are getting real sick of it. Stop the personal slurs, and stick to the issues, can't you?

Hey, Some one should help these two gals how to dress properly for a nite on the town. I wouldn't take either one out wearing a T-Shirt. CZ

Hey, Some one should help these two gals how to dress properly for a nite on the town. I wouldn't take either one out wearing a T-Shirt. CZ

Hey, Some one should help these two gals how to dress properly for a nite on the town. I wouldn't take either one out wearing a T-Shirt. CZ

I read people complaining about Cindy Sheehan's freedom of speech being taken away. But you don't talk about President Bush's freedom of speech. The State of the Union address was his time to exercise this right and Cindy Sheehan wanted to disrupt that with her t-shirt. Her freedom has not been taken away, this letter shows that.

I read people lauding Hugo Chavez and the what their state run papers are printing. Do you think that President Chavez would allow a blog like this to exist in his country? Do you think he would freely allow people to criticize him? My opinion is no.

Also, the articles those papers print. You have the freedom to run the same stories here. If you feel that the mainstream papers are not reporting an important story then you have the freedom to report that on your own, just open your own blog.

I find it funny how liberals have such a strong stance on human rights and yet America is helping 30,000,000 Iragi people to overcome tyranny and suffering that they have been going through for 30 years. I guess it only applies to people who don't have the right to marry someone of the same sex or can't go to there local clinic to get an abortion.

To the Tribune;
On the incident in the House gallery. Bush does not like dissent. They never have and do all they can do to inhibit it. They are not brilliant so don't figure things out quickly enough. So just have to bear with them and hope they do not badly injure our freedoms. They are our internal crisis. Thanks.

What is with all the socialist bantering about how Chavez would make America better? His government is stealing land from private owners and giving it to people of his choice. Is that freedom? Pravda was a state run newspaper and I don't think it won too many journalistic awards.
Hitler was a democratically elected leader, too, but that doesn't mean he should have been allowed to stay in office.
The idea that Bush, or any US president is inherently "evil" is the talk of people who are losing touch with reality. Keep bashing corporate America and then who are you going to cry to when there aren't any jobs for you?

To J. Arrigo:

What you say may be true (I haven't verified), but that still doesn't get to Cindy's POINT. In fact, you've just proved her point of our freedoms being removed. Why? Because the judicial branch of the government is there to enforce the law, not interpret it. Just because many decades ago (I assume) the US Supreme Court takes it upon themselves to interpret the First Ammendment and use it as a tool to squelch speech when it's convenient for the government DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT. Nor does it make it lawful.

Don't drone on as if your reality is the truth. You're reality are just the facts. And as we've all seen, the fact that WMDs were in Iraq were not necessarily the truth. You said it yourself. "The U.S. Supreme Court long ago determined ..." Huh? They *determined*? Who the hell are they to determine (i.e. code for interpret) what the first ammendment meant?

I believe our forefathers meant what they wrote and wrote what they meant: Freedom of speech - period. No arguements.

Be part of the solution, would you Arrigo? Don't walk around with your eyes wide shut.

I support the troops wholeheartly. Lets get them out of a hopeless situation. Enough sensless deaths .

I have tried to cut this woman some slack because she has lost a son, which is tragic to say the least. BUT let's also remember that her son signed up on his own free will as an adult. He knew the dangers going in...By Ms. Sheehan stating that the insurgents over in Iraq are the real "freedom fighters"....She is the one disgracing what her son was fighting for. Apparently in her on-going grief, she has forgotten that freedom of speech does not allow you to go into a crowded theatre and shout "fire"....there are limits. Ms Sheehan also does not note in her letter that another woman (a congressman's wife) was also escorted out as a "protester"...wearing a pro troops t-shirt. Thus both sides were treated equally. I initially supported Ms. Sheehan and her right to speak her mind about the war....but she has become such a pawn to the extreme left and obviously loves the camera, that her words only ring hollow. I hope she finds her peace someday...

I think Cindy Sheehan and Beverly Young have started a fabulous trend that the White House should seize upon -- have ALL guests of the State of the Union address wear their favorite T-shirt! It would trump the Oscars in press anticipation, coverage and commentary. The administration could also be judged on how well they balanced their guests and thus how well they reflect democratic principles.

The one telling point of this entire story was, one woman was hauled out of there in cuffs, was stuffed in a cruiser and sent to the police station, while the other one was calmly asked to leave the premises. If that isn't a clear bias I don't know what is.

Free Speech is Free speech until you disagree with this administration. I can't wait for 2008.....

I would really love to know where this Sheehan was when HER son was joining the military. How come she did not stop him from joining then? Did she no know that maybe he would have to fight in a war, no matter if the war was legit or not?

I would bet that she wanted him to get what the military offered him in schooling ad perks.

To me, she is beating her drum a little too late now.

It amazes me that any sane person would compare a state run newspaper to the NYT. Oh wait. No sane person did that.

Can someone ask Ms Sheehan how many men died during World War II. It was a lot more than 2245, also.
FYI people - there were many who argued against the US's involvement in WWII, but that doesn't make them right.
Casey Sheehan's wife and children have ZERO contact with his mother. Do you wonder why that is?

Ms. Sheehan states that she is not going to let Bush take anything from us, well, Ms. Sheehan, you aren't fighting on my behalf because I haven't lost anything because of President Bush. My children are part of the military personnel defending against terrorism and I'm proud of it. Ms. Sheehan dishonors her son's memory with her words and actions, she should be ashamed of herself.

behind you 100%

I CAN NOT BELIEVE WHAT HAS HAS HAPPENED TO OUR COUNTRY TODAY . WHERE HAS AMERICA GONE.

I see Ms. Sheehan as a rabble rouser. I don't disagree with her right to protest and to express her viewpoint but there is a time and place for everything. The time and place that she chose was inappropriate. It's become very obvious that Ms. Sheehan will do just about anything to keep her face in front of the public and I, for one, am tired of seeing it. As the closest relative of s man that gave his life for his nation, she deserves a certain amount on consideration but there is one thing that we should remember....it was her son that gave his life, not her. If her son was able to voice his opinion, I would gladly listen quietly to anything that he had to say. Ms. Sheehan has had several opportunities to make her viewpoint known, now she need to go home and find something else to justify her existence.

I assume since my earlier comments were not posted that even I as a moderate democrat that DOES NOT SUPPORT Cindy Sheehan, will not be posted.
So to that I say, If you think Venezuela is an affluent, middle class society, you are dead wrong. If you think that living in a socialist country is a picnic why don't you ask the hundreds of thousands who move into this country everyday from Venezuela.

Your viciuos attacks on Bush are unfounded. The attacks have merit against the USA government but not Bush singularly. You attribute to much of the wrongs in the USA to Bush. As an example you Bash bushes stance regarding Chavez, but the democratic party hold the same position so to be fair one should attck all in the US government and not just Bush alone. That just shows your bias and hatred and ignorance.

Everyboby shoud read Lewis Lapham ( Editor of Harper's magazine) book on dissent: "Gag Rule"
The truth expressed in an intelligent way to describe how the elected dictature now in power in the USA and the passivity of all media and half of the population will contribute to what history will regard as a stepping stone of shame.
And this was written prior to the wiretaping scandal..
When will America wake up from its induced coma?

Cindy Sheehan is first and foremost an oppotunist.

Honest action rooted in grief has long ago given way to a blind crusade to embarrass the president of the United States. In paragraph four she she makes it sound like she just happened to be wearing the shirt when she received an invitation to go to the SOTU. Later she says she wore the shirt to "make a statement."

It's this duplicity that betrays her real intentions. Cindy needs to shed the sheeps clothing of the grieving mother and be honest with herself and her fellow citizens. She can't stand the president and she's made a cottage industry out of her hatred.

President Bush did something no Democrat would ever consider. He acted decisively rather than negotiate with perceived terrorist threats. The duplicity of Arab terrorists who made wild threats on the one hand and then profess to have no means to carry out these threats on the other was testing reasonable people everywhere but only the United States had the will to say "Enough."

The fact that Iraq is continues to be such a challenge proves how necessary it was to get involved there immediately.

Cindy Sheehan is a disgrace to herself, her son and the people of the United States.

Why is Cindy Sheehan home with her husband and 3 children. She is getting to be old news and should move on with her life. Nobody wants to lose a child, but her son has to enlist of his own free will(because there is no draft) and he knew the risks of war. Nobody likes war but it has been here for years and there will always be wars, it doesn't matter who is in office. George W. Bush is not afraid to stand up for what he believes in, thats more than I can say for any DEMOCRAT! I think that Cindy Sheehan should be arrested to meeting with Hugo Chavez, he a militant and a threat to the USA. Why don't people rally around their President instead of blaming him for everything. Long live George W. Bush!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is obvious now that the arrest was illegal since all charges have been dropped and the police have issued Sheehan an official apology.

This kind of thing from the Republicans is nothing new- at their national convention in NYC to nominate Bush many protestors were rounded up and arrested in the morning and then released, with no charges, later in the evening once the TV cameras had packed up. A detailed account of one man who suffered this denial of freedom was aired on ABC news with quite a solemn warning- but of course the MSM is corporate-owned and those news stories did not keep their legs- once on the air, then gone forever from the public mind.

I mourn for Ms. Sheehan's loss. Her son died, defending the freedom of the Iraqi citizens. These citizens, just a few short years ago, were living in fear and despair. Saddam's character is similar to the characteristics of Stalin, Hitler, and Mao. Her son died honorably, as a soldier, and she can take that with her to her grave.

Now, does she have the right to protest? Yes. She has that right. Did her actions qualify for getting arrested? I don't know. There are two very different sides to this story. All I do know is that anti-abortion protesters and those who protested the US going into the former Yugoslavia during the Clinton administration received the same treatment as Ms. Sheehan. It was not reported by the national media, however.

So, why are you complaining now? Where was the protest ten years ago? Sadly, the issue really has nothing to do with Ms. Sheehan's rights being violated (they weren't if you read the constitution). This is about people who hate President Bush and his policies. Just be honest, and stop being hypocrites, and you will get a lot more respect.

There are a lot of just reasons to challenge this administration and its policies, but instead, people are focusing on these silly side-shows. It is nothing more than a farse and a circus. President Bush did not win because of his popularity or ideas. He won because a majority of the populous was sick of these side-shows. This is also why the Democrats have lost in both houses of the legislature.

So focus on real issues and offer real solutions. If you have a complaint or if something is wrong, state it, and explain what the solution would be.

For example, if we leave Iraq now, all those who died will have died for nothing, because a terrorist group would eventually take over the country, and everything Ms. Sheehan's son fought for would be for naught, and then she would really have something to mourn over. So, if you don't like our troops being there, develop a plausible solution. What is the solution? You really don't hear too much of a debate over that, because we are focusing on Ms. Sheehan's personal grief and selfishness.

How dare the military send her son, a soldier, to war? He was killed by militants, not by President Bush. He was doing his job, and he served honorably. I know her grief and pain is real, but her justification for her actions is irrational.

So let's stop focusing on this, and start focusing on the real issues.

bush is the true enemy of the american people. if the war was lost the govenment he invaded could try him as a war criminal.

I wonder if J. Arrigo would be so cavalier if the government, without prior notice, decided that something he or she was doing was disrespectful. If he or she were humiliated, cuffed and held against his will for breaking the latest unwritten rule.

The cop who grabbed Sheehan didn't yell bomb or gun or even Chavez. He yelled protester. Yelled it. He could have whispered up his arm or talked into a walkie talkie.

The officer could have simply called her over and explained that vocal disruption would be grounds for her ouster, and moved her to the aisle seat. Problem solved.

So, his training obviously has impressed upon him the danger presented by someone who silently disagrees with Bush.

Personally, I think this nation has always liked emperors for presidents, and that comfort grows exponentially when the people are scared. So we hear now about respect for government, respect for the elected, even, in this case, respect for occasions.

Among the items we must fear now is the T-shirt. Way to go, people. It's true. No one follows more obediently than the democrat.

Most people might assume that Ms. Sheehan is a loon, and that argument would certainly be compelling. However, she, like another assummed loon--Howard Dean---is actually another Republican operative under the control of Karl Rove.

For those of you who are praising the likes of Hugo Chavez, be aware that the NSA is monitoring your thoughts.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?

It is sad that two people that we know of) can be forceable ejected from the gallery for doing nothing but wear a message on their t-shirts. There is no freedom of speech left in the U.S. that I can see.

The freedom of speech issue is truly arbitrary. If one just walks down the street wearing some sort of protest slogan, it is probably ok. If one instead walks into a public place i.e courthouse hallway, DMV office,city, state, or U.S. government building,all of which supposedly belong to all of us, it apparently is not ok. The fact that the D.C. police later apologized shows that government officials or police don't have any rational for how they act. It is like the old wild west saying, "shoot first and ask questions later" which is obviously a terrible thing to do in todays culture.
Today, authorities take the same approach, arrest first and ask questions later. Fortunately Ms Sheehan and Ms Young (especially Young who is a Senators' spouse)had enough public recognition where the absurd charges were dropped.

Since neither Shehan or Young stood up and shouted, cursed, or otherwised created a commotion why the arrests?. If they had done so, yes they should have been simply escorted out simply to allow nearby spectators to hear. For some people in the gallery, it might just be their one chance in a lifetime to sit there for such an important presidential speech.

Poor Mother Sheehan, she is constantly being abused. Maybe if she would do something constructive rather than constantly try to focus attention upon herself, she could gain the admiration and sympathy of the majority of Americans rather than the pity and revulsion she has heretofore evoked.

What part of the requirement for the president to communicate to the legislative representative body required that Cindy Sheehan be in attendance? And why would a democratic representative feel the need to alert the media of her attendance? And assuming that she was a guest for any legitimate political purpose, what would compell her to wear a shirt with obvious political emotional potential. A T shirt even? This is a formal event. A little decorum should have been expected. This was a premeditated occurance. Its also shameful to hide this disgraceful behavior on both Cindy Sheehan's and the Representative from California behind the banner of free speech.

Its obvious that this is another stunt by Democrats to distract American voters from the realities of their political agenda and track record. The negativity, partisanship and politicizing for personal gain is unappreciated.

I'm getting pretty tired of hearing about this woman. She is not the only mother who has lost a son in our war against terrorism, but she's the only one we ever hear about. Bush has many faults, but I admire his courage in facing an enemy that past administrations chose to ignore. If we did nothing and waited for the next attack on our soil, Cindy Sheehan would be the first one crying that Bush did nothing to prevent it. No, I do not have a son or daughter at war, but that does not mean that I do not feel for the families of this countrie's lost sons and daughters. It's about time that an administration stepped up to the plate and dealt with the dangers facing this country instead of doing nothing. Proactive instead of reactice is a proper solution and Bush got my vote as a result.

Cindy
I agree you have the right to protest what you beleive in. I also have the right to beleive you are a ego freek who is making a name by disrespecting the memory of her son. Your son was not drafted he acted in a way he saw was honorable you on the other hand act out vengence
Yes i had the honor of serving in the Marine corp. and yes some of my frend did not make it back and yes we had our own cindy even back then
many of us still refer to her as Hanoi Jane. Cindy I apoligize anger does not bring back freind or loved ones it does the human heart no
good I may not agree with George W. But he alone
is the Comander and Cheif . Think of the pain
this man has to live with every day, but thank God he has the guts to do what must be done.
CIndy I hope your 15 minutes of fame is worth the disrepect you are showing to the 2244 and the one hero in your family now deceased.

Ms. Sheehan:
What you believe about our President's "arrogance" is your own business. And the Constitution guarantees you the right to trumpet those beliefs anywhere you can get someone to listen. However, I also have those same rights, and in MY opinion, you have dishonored your son, the rest of the troops -no matter where they are stationed - our country, and your President.
By all means, grieve for your son, but have some pity on the rest of us who don't share your beliefs and do it quietly and OUT of the media! Your First Amendment rights come to a screeching halt the second they infringe upon mine.

Think about this--we are a country that holds up democracy as the way to be. Our use of the word freedom is in every speech broadcast throughout the world. Now, we remove a woman expressing her freedom of speech from a government building and that clip of information is broadcast throughout the world. If we hold ourselves as the example of democracy, who can blame the people and countries around the world who don't believe us, they are only believing what they see.

I must say that I am dissapointed in the media for obsessing about Cindy Sheehan. Every time I see the woman, she like a parrott, says the same thing over and over. She wants to know why her son died. Well one reason is so that in the future in a country like IRAQ, a woman who possibly loses a son or daughter like Cindy will have the right to stand outside the gates of their leader, and question them.Without the fear of dissapearing. Her son was a hero, as for Cindy, in my opinion nothing more than another liberal who wont rest until other nations have a say in our Great Countries soverign right to rule. As for those of you who thinks she would be a great politician, what the hell are you smoking, please defect to Velenzuela, so serious patriots can get on with the real business of government. The allocation of our tax dollars, and our Nations security. Good Job George W, I would not have wasted my time with the hack either.

Yet another instance of a Tribune reporter giving free publicity to the left-wing "moonbat du jour", Cindy Sheehan. How predictable.

To all those who support Hugo Chavez and Cindy Sheehan. Please let everyone know your views. Speak them loudly. Tell your friends, co workers and neighbors all about how you think the America we once knew is dead and how you support Cindy and Hugo. Remind them to vote democrat after your sililoquy on Cindy and Hugo.
If that doesn't work, chant "bush lied" and remind them about the Downing Street Memos, Halliburton, and any Michael Moore movie. Please keep this up at least until 2008. We Republicans....I mean U.S. citizens need your help.

Come on everybody "Clinton lied no one died, Clinton lied no one died" You in the tie dye. You two socialists. Come on and join in!

If nothing works, give your friends and neighbors a witty liberal bumper sticker or a "mean people suck" sticker. Rememeber that if anyone brings logic into an argument and proves you wrong, just call them a racist or facist. That will make you feel better.

The general level of debate here and all over america is that of 12 year olds. high on emotion, low on restraint or fact or intellectual rigour. you all seem to define yourselves by your allegiences. no-one is reasoning anything out. you people have a good, well intentioned constitution and everyone is abusing it to the max. calm down and get a grip. i call it allegience hysteria. its the first dawning of totalitarianism.

It is very apparent to anyone with ears that Bush II is a bumbling idiot who cannot speak extemporaneously and has made us the joke of the earth. The rest of the world was willing to give us a pass the first time he was "elected" by the SCOTUS, but now we get what's coming to us by keeping him in office for a second term. By that I mean no respect internationally (see Iran's comments regarding the "mistake" with WMD's in Iraq and their claim of the same being done with their nuke program--who can blame them for trying?)as well as a country divided. It is unreal to me that Bush has not been impeached, but this is only because of the Republican-held Congress. Clinton lied to Congress about a sex act, not WMD's and spying on Americans. Come 2006, when Americans finally stop listening to the fear-mongers, cease focusing on side issues such as gay marriage and abortion, and start paying attention to our (declining) status in the world, our massive deficit, and issues that should really matter, the Republican majority will be no more and GW Bush will face the fate he truly deserves. How will Republicans win when something like 60+% of people polled said they'd be less likely to vote for a candidate whom Bush supports? "No thank you Mr. President, I'd rather not have you at my campaign event." Wow--what a winner!! I'd love to see Bush answer questions on the fly--that would be true comic relief.

Cindy Sheehan is a mother who has paid the ultimate sacrifice that any mother could pay, having her son die. SHE HAS EVERY RIGHT TO SPEAK OUT.
Those that call her names or ask her to leave the US
dishonor all who have died in defence of our freedom. Cindy Sheehan is speaking up peacefully for what she believes in. Shame on all of those who throw mud at her. Disagree by all means, but damm it show some respect.

CINDY.... WHO?

attn: all neocon sympathizers...
do any of you know how to post links to support your arguments..?
for example, if i told you this jack abramoff scandal has a pretty good chance of causing the entire republican party in washington to implode the way it has here in illinois, i'd direct you to some sites that contained pertinent information, like these:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/30/AR2005043001147_2.html

http://www.madcowprod.com/06202005.html

or if i wanted to make the argument that the official 9/11 story was not factually accurate i'd point you all this way...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/prweb/20060130/bs_prweb/prweb339303_5
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1559151.stm

or if i wanted to illustrate that neocons are generally chickenhawks i might point you in this direction...

http://www.awolbush.com/whoserved.html

support your arguments folks, if all you want to do is vent some steam about how much you hate cindy sheehan, just phone it in to rush, otherwise you're wasting our time here...

Hold on Just a moment. Whichever side of this issue you take, let's not throw the word "fascist" around so easily. Comparing any country with an impressive (although not without serious shadows and downfalls) history for tolerance and DIVERSITY, with the ultra-ethno nationalistic and racist regimes that developed starting at the beginning and middle of the previous century (which precipitated the deaths of EASILY over 30 million people in this world[a very conservative estimate, PLEASE check for YOURSELVES]... I repeat, MILLION people - Thats 30,000,000 human lives - Well over 100 times the deathtoll of the recent and tragic Tsunami) is absurd, and rather shortsighted. I urge you to make your points, argue it out - I commend you for being true to the undieing American spirit. But please, PLEASE, don't make light of the plague upon the world that threatened so much, such a short time ago.

-A 21 year old kid who tries hard to *think* about what he says and writes.

Well, I guess all you lefties should just pack up your bags and move to different countries if it is just so bad here. You don't like it, LEAVE. The people spoke on election day, deal with it. The extreme left with all of its rubbish is a slap in the face of my grandfathers who served for this country.

I did get a particular chuckle from Nikki's comment on Clinton's lie being less than Bush's. I don't care what you say a lie is a lie. Either way Clinton tried to pull the wool over our eyes. And lets not forget who sold off a healthy portion of out Naval oil reserves, which affected the price of fuel...oh yea, Clinton. Or perhaps we can count the multiple times bin laden was caught and Clinton let him go because he didn't do anything specifically to the U.S. , even though the facts about his organization where well known in the early ninties. How fast we forget these details, but remember that new juicy gossip that give the left a reason to feel sorry for themselves for loosing the election.

One more thing, Sheehan is a puppet of the left. It was a small movement where she only wanted to talk with the president over the issues. What is it now? A national movement that became a bandwagon for extreme left to voice their utterly invaluable thoughts and opinions.

erik,
are you enlisted? why aren't you over in iraq fighting?
or did you earn your purple heart in the war on christmas?

So Erik, when was the last time You served your country?

I'm glad you find amusement in Nikki's comments. So let's then accept that a lie is a lie. So, then should the response to the lies at least be the same? If Bush lied to get the US into a war where over 2000 American lives have been lost, over 20,000 injured, 100 thousand Iraqi's have died, shouldn't then we at least take the same course as we did with Clinton's sexual indiscretions?

If, as you say, a lie is a lie, then we the people of the United States should be able to demand, and expect the same response to the lie by the Congress conducting impeachment hearings. This won't happen though, or at least not until there is a shift in Congress, because a lie is not a lie. Your right wing rhetoric says it all. Bush won, so he's somehow been empowered to do whatever he wants, even spy on the citizens of this country, start wars based on lies, and throw only a crumb to those citizens of New Orleans and the Gulf Coast, and no hope that he will even come close to meeting the promises he met to those fellow citizens.

So, Erik, I ask again, how do YOU serve your country? What is it that you do to fight for her or guide her? Or are you satified marching lock step, accepting the loss of basic liberties? I'm assuming your young. So you have time. I hope.

I am also tired of Cindy Sheehan. I served in the US Navy as a Hospital Corpsman. I was not old enough to be active during any conflicts. I CHOSE to enlist knowing the hazards, especially the ones for Hospital Corpsman. For those who do not know, they provide the medical support for the Marines on the front line.

I agree there is a time and place for freedom of speech, but the SOTU address is NOT one of them. I have to agree with those who have posted she is only doing this for attention. My mother and grand mother lost a brother and an only son in Viet Nam. They picked up and moved on. Her son enlisted on his own free will.

Let's leave her alone and she WILL go away. Stop giving her the attention she seeks and she WILL go away. She is like a child, the more attention she gets, the more she will seek.

After following mom Sheehan's story for some time, I'm convinced her son wasn't killed in Iraq...he committed suicide. Even in death he will find no peace from this woman.

Attn Karl B.

You forgot a few links in your "argument" Perhaps you didn't find them on buzzflash.com
If I wanted to prove that others were saying the same things about Iraq long before Bush was president I would post this:

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=RNWE,RNWE:2004-49,RNWE:en&q=clinton+iraq+1998

If I wanted to prove that not only Republicans were involved with Abramhoff I would link this:

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2006/Feb-03-Fri-2006/news/5696811.html

If I wanted to prove that many Iraqi's were very glad we invaded, I would link this:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/12/14/sprj.nirq.iraqi.reaction/

Oh, and my condolances on the West Wing being cancelled.

Hey Just steve, I'm sure Erik pays his taxes, votes if he is able and shows up for jury duty. That is all this country asks. Not bad considering what we get in return.

To all lefties who continue the childish argument of "ohh, if your so for the war, we don't you go?
" Its as dumb as anyone saying "if you don't like the country, then leave"

If your so against the war, why don't you go be a peace activist or a human shield? A high school kid made it over there on his own, I'm sure you could too. If you are so for fighting crime, why don't you join the Police force. If you are so for fighting fires, why don't you join the Fire Dept? If you are so for gay marraige why don't you have gay sex with someone then marry them?

See how retarded your argument becomes?

Never in our history has there been a President who has so denigrated our international reputation while doing so little for the people of his own country (except maybe the top 1% of earners). Bush is the opposite of King Midas--everything he touches turns to crap. I ask anybody, what will Bush's legacy be? Democracy in Iraq? Not at the pace at which it's going right now. Revamping the tax code, social security, or health care? Not likely, as his proposals are empty and so devisive only his bible-thumping diehard followers even consider them worth supporting. A booming economy? The data are good, but just look at those poll numbers--they reflect just how poorly data correlate to reality in America. Selling out to big energy with massive tax cuts while they rein in record profits on the backs of American consumers? Holding back US scientific research in the name of religion while the rest of the world laughs and our best researchers flee? Invoking the horror of 9/11 constantly as a reason to abuse presidential power? That all sounds about right. For those who say if you don't like this country, leave--that is a typical response of those who have no cogent retorts to the criticisms. Why should I leave just because I'm unhappy with the status quo and am vocal about it? If you're so irritated by my writings, there are lots of other web pages for you to go to, or maybe you could even reply with facts of your own! (Well, in support of Bush, there's really little to choose from, no matter how you spin it.) I welcome replies and well-thought out arguments to my own, as do most intelligent people who are confident in their own arguments and have facts with which to back them.

Hmmm.. seems to me, in this country, we are supposed to have the freedom of speech. That does include being able to wear a shirt that says 2000 or so dead, how many more? Now, as far as im concerned, she shouldve been able to wear what she wanted, as long as it covered her body. Now, she was speaking out, quietly against the war. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. She WAS arrested, and was arrested for wearing a T-shirt. C'mon, people, this is not some extreme liberalism here, it was just a friggin t-shirt. She was exercising the right of freedom of speech, that her son gave his life for, and other U.S. military men and women before him. I hope and pray, that some day people will that this is why the constitution was written. That Bush administration will admit when they make mistakes. Ya know, theres nothing wrong with that. Its called being wrong, and there's been plenty of that in the last century or three. Not that there is one politician out there that would admit it. take care and good luck to you Cindy.

There have been a number of suggestions above that those of us who are in agony over the creeping horrors that are afflicting our country should leave it. You are allowing these cretins in power to steal our country away from us; it is you who should leave, and let those of us who love the United States stay and fight to get it back.

If it were only those of you who worship Bush that were being affected, I would be happy to allow you to make the choice for yourselves to give up all your civil liberties, and send your young people off to die or be maimed in foreign lands so you don't have to be afraid of the boogey-man, and have your publicly-owned lands sold to the highest foreign bidder, and pay through the nose to stay warm and be mobile, and struggle to pay your mortgage even though every adult in your home is working full-time plus, and give up any rights you have to a safe workplace and decent wage, and have the water you drink and the air you breathe poisoned so your "betters" can make a few extra bucks, and burden your children with massive debt, and have the local authorities start monitoring your daily life. But I am not going to let you make that choice for me and mine, and I am not going to leave my family and run away.

I always wondered, growing up, why the Nazi's were able to take over in Germany, and why so many of the German people did nothing to stop the growing threat there during the thirties. Now, I am starting to see how it happened. Those who did stand up were imprisoned, and we are starting to see that happen here. Those who whole-heartedly supported Hitler's government strutted and preened during his reign, as you do in these posts, but ended up slithering back into the shadows after his defeat, or fled for their lives. You may hide behind screen names on the internet, but your neighbors know who you are, and will never forget how you dishonored our founding fathers and threatened our heritage of representative government.

If we don't remove these people from office soon, we are in for a long haul. The Nazi's were defeated by our armed forces, but the Soviet Union persisted for 60 years. There is no other gleaming bastion of democracy to come to our rescue, so it is up to us to take back our country. And if you don't like it, I suggest YOU move.

Trudi, put down the kool aid. Take a deep breath. Everything is going to be ok. If you compare the last 5 years of Bush's presidency to Hitler'r Nazi Germany, you either are not being honest with yourself or have a poor grasp of history. It's also an insult to anyone who suffered under Hitler's Nazi Germany. Bush has 3 more years in office regardless of what happens.

The fact that Cindy Sheehan is alive and well and still speaking should show you that we are not like the Nazi's. A "pro Bush" person was ejected as well. They are both fine. You are talking about it and your only repercussion is my email in response. No one is going to take your computer away or cancel your Internet Service.

MM Logic:

Reading is a skill.

Nowhere did I say that Erik needed to join the military to participate in our Democracy. I did serve (in the Marines), but I don't expect everyone to follow that path.

What bothers me is that in one breath Erik attempts to equate Clinton's "lying" with Bush's. Which is fine. I don't happen to agree that they are at the same level, but if he wants to make that argument, he certainly has that right. So, if they are equated, then shouldn't the Congress at least treat them in the same way? I mean we had soepenas flying left and right, we had congressional investigations, we had impeachment hearings for gosh sakes. Now we have a President who fixed the facts around a conclusion that brought this country into a war, where our military is in harm's way, and what does the Congress do? Nothing... they don't even talk about it.

So you can disagree with me all you want, and you can say that my argument is doesn't work, but you calling it names doesn't change the reality we are living in now. And that is that you "righties" are selling this nation's freedoms away for nothing... for oil... so that Mobil can make record profits. So, gee, thanks.

Just Steve

To WhatHappenedToUs:

Since it appears you are unaware, the legislative branch is charged by the Constitution with enacting the laws (Article I), the executive branch with enforcing the laws (Article II) and the judiciary with interpreting them (Article III). So you think that this function of the judiciary is unwanted and unnecessary? I hope that you have at least heard of a case called Marbury v. Madison – the case in which the Supreme Court established its power of judicial review: the ability of that Court (which is not beholden to the fickle winds of public opinion or political expediency) to determine whether the enactments of the Congress were consistent with the requirements of the Constitution. Personally, I am glad this protection is around. And one who appears to be firmly planted in the liberal camp, you should be, too. Because the alternative is a system in which a bunch of guys who grease enough palms to be elected get to impose upon everyone their own private morality the second they gain a majority. Can you say “bye-bye Roe v. Wade” and "hello religious Right"? Moreover, if – as you suggest – the First Amendment is absolute, we all CAN yell “fire” in a crowded theater and all of the people who die being trampled as a result are just out of luck. Sorry, I prefer a little bit of accountability and order under the rule of law.

To Jim Nash:

I never take a restraint of speech “cavalierly”. But, as noted above, there’s a time and a place. By the same token, I also think respect for the institutions of our Republic and a wee bit of decorum are what separates civilization from chaos. Ms. Sheehan appears to possess neither.

hey barbarea streisand,
thanks for posting those links... that's really all i'm asking those of you on the right to do, support your arguments...
as for the abramoff scandal, i don't believe i implied in any way that there isn't corruption on both sides of the aisle, merely that this abramoff scandal is essentially a republican scandal it's republicans who appear to be in serious trouble. here's a link...

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/wp-print.php?p=6471

the link about happy iraqis is just too easy to respond to but here goes anyway...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A22403-2004May12.html
http://www.antiwar.com/news/?articleid=2444

and as far as clinton goes, well you assume i'm a fan but i'm not. however, i'd defend his decision not to invade as surely as i'd defend the words w.'s dad had to say about invading iraq...

http://tianews.blogspot.com/2004/08/father-knows-best.html

oh, and i've never seen the west wing but since i guess we're being snarky i'll offer my condolences on walker:texas ranger being cancelled.

I think it is sad she lost her son. I thought that after her first, second, and third appearances... then we she began to tear on cue, and pitch a tent near Crawford... I started to
really feel embarrassed for her family! A person with even nominal intelligence can see that she is being used by whack-job leftist groups.
Ultimately, after the appearance with that awful pip-squeek of a man, Chavez... This lady is either not on her designated medication - or perhaps she SHOULD be on some! Cindy-rella, I am afraid your chariot has turned back in to a pumpkin, luv. Give it up!

I've been writing here for the past 2 weeks and all of the sudden im getting parking tickets on my vehicle for parking in spaces that are obviously legal and this is the third one in two weeks.
Who's out to get me and why. By the way, in 1996 the man passed a law that made back doors in all communications software, ie, your firewalls and internet privacy and phone, all have back doors. It's a law. The patriot act is a legal thing in case they want to prosecute you in a court of law.

Whoever said "troops are there because they want to be" hit the nail right on the head." Cindy Sheehan's son obviously wanted to SERVE her country...and he did. She, on the other hand, is doing nothing productive, other than further divide an already seperated country. I am sick of hearing her complain. Plus if she has "bruises and muscle spasms" I would urge her to show them. Really, I don't believe any of the "patriotic" crap coming out of her mouth. Especially the paragraph where she says "I have lost my son, and my first ammendment." If she truly cared about out country, she would be quietly mourning like the other 2245 families, not sucking up press time.

Trudi --

Your post, 03 Feb 2:48 PM, is one of the best in this thread. Very even-handed and well thought out. I'm convinced too, that Bush is on par with playing out Hitler's first five years with a million little fascist pieces; that Bush's despotism is a large rack of political hacks topping the executive branch agencies and taking away our rights with regs-with-the-force-of-law, a majority of individuals in both major parties and especially Congress, and a significant number of the judges on the federal bench -- all in collusion to benefit money-power, divide the ordinary people against themselves, and protect all Bushies from the Constitutional checks and balances; and that Bush violated both Constitution and federal statute 18 USC 241 -- criminal conspiracy against citizen rights -- when he usurped the presidency in January 2001, violating the people's rights to have a president elected in accord with the Constitution.

His violation of 18 USC 241 at the onset means that we can criminally prosecute him even while he is a sitting president. It also means that we have excellent grounds to selectively rip out every law that he has signed, to throw out every federal judge he has ever advanced, and to reverse every Emergency Order he has ever decreed.

Note that the invasion and occupation of Iraq are two different things legally. Bush's order to invade Iraq was unconstitutional. He violated our soldiers' citizen rights to be sent to war ONLY on the direct order of Congress. In doing that, he violated 18 USC 241 again. This violation, however, carries sterner consequences. Per 18 USC 241, if death or maiming results from the conspiracy against citizen rights, then conviction can result in sentences of life imprisonment or death.

This is what the collusions among the three branches of our fascist despotism is protecting Bush-Cheney-Rice-Ashcroft-Gonzales-Rumsfeld from.

I'm convinced that we need an impeachment and removal Congress for Bush-Cheney-Rice-Gonzales-Rumsfeld out of Election 2006; that several of the US Supreme Court justices need to be impeached and removed for their unconstitutonal rulings to benefit Bush-Cheney and money-power; and that none of that is possible without ordinary Americans coming together to take back and protect their rights, freedoms, and liberties.

None of what should happen to preserve our nation can happen without a significant number of Americans working together, interstate.

Do something. Start now.

Is there anyone moderating this forum? Why was Mark Simms' post allowed? Suggesting that Casey Sheehan wasn't killed in Iraq but rather committed suicide to get away from his mother is utterly base and offensive and furthermore contributes nothing to the debate. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion of Cindy Sheehan, but I think we would all appreciate a little decency in expressing it. Thanks.

I suppose I should preface this post with the fact I am serving in the military and am currently in Iraq.
I will tell you this, you cannot support your soldiers in any conflict without supporting the conflict. It's a money issue plain and simple. These soldiers will not receive what they need unless America is behind. So, don't cry the left or right did it. America has to stand behind this conflict so that soldiers are taken care. You don't have to agree with it or like George W., but we have a whole lot of American boys and girls here that need America as a whole to stand behind them and get them equipment and their basic needs met.
As far as Ms. Sheehan goes, grieve you son and use him as your platform, but leave the other 2244 or whatever you T-shirt said out of it. It's disgraceful and offensive. There are parents that support this war, give them a call and find out what their position is then when you whittle down the number put that in your pipe and smoke it. Don't use the deaths of my friends for you talking points, it's offensive. Enough said.

williams --

No, not anywhere near enough said. You don't get to end the discussion with your infantile emotional outburst.

Criticizing the rightful behavior of adults is always your right. However, when you obviously lack the experience, historical knowledge, legal understandings, and rights recognition that would make your ctiticism fair, you're just spitting into the wind.

There are tens of thousands of ex-military, from generals to privates -- with experience way beyond yours, with extensive historical knowledge of politics and war, with legal understandings beyond your grasp, and a love of rights more sophisticated than you can even imagine for now -- who both support the individuals in our armed forces and who reject everything about the conflict. There's nothing tough about doing both. I'm one of those who does them easily.

There is no such thing as "values" that can overturn American rights, freedoms, and liberties as given in the Constitution and laws. "Regime change" -- the forcing of one govt's "values" onto another nation -- is just another term for "war of aggression". The Nazis did it throughout WW2.

There were no Iraqi WMDs. There was no connection between Iraq and the 9-11 attacks. There was no connection between al Qaeda and Iraq. All of those "reasons" for the invasion of Iraq were lies.

The invasion and the occupation are two different things, legally. They are not political matters. They are not a matter of political dog and pony shows staged by the Bush-Cheney Tap Dancers. Each is an entity with legal definitions and legal consequences -- to be settled in the legal realm of courts, not in the political realm. We the sovereign people forced Nazi war criminals into the legal realm after WW2, and we will force the Bush thugs into the legal realm after Iraq, despite their Nazi-like secrecy and anti-rights machinations.

The Constitution tells us that soldiers have the citizen rights to be sent to war ONLY on the express order of Congress. The 1945 federal statute, 18 USC 241 (Google it), tells us that if a conspiracy of officials violates our soldiers' citizen rights -- and that the violation of rights leads to death and/or maiming -- then the convicted co-conspirators can be sentenced to life imprisonment or to death.

Pretty serious stuff, you know, the violation of citizen rights. Reason is, citizen rights are the foundation of the American nation. Many of my direct ancestors fought as patriots in the War of Independence that built that foundation. I can get real surly when anybody uses their political, religious, or family "values" to overturn any part of that rights foundation.

Only Congress has the Constitutional right to order soldiers into war. No other branch's representatives have that right. Nowhere in the Constitution does it say that Congress -- or any other branch -- has the right to give away any of the powers assigned to it in the Constitution. Congress' October 2002 give-away of its Constitutional war powers was every bit as illegal as Bush's order to invade Iraq. Bush-Cheney, Congress, the courts, and the generals knew that clearly.

Soldier's rights violations in the Iraq invasion have resulted in felony murder and felony maimings. There is no statute of limitations for felony murder. The Bush Illegitimacy's thugs face legal consequences for the felony murder of our soldiers in Iraq for the rest of their unnatural lives.

How do you want those of us who understand the unconstitutinality and illegality of the invasion to behave? Do you want us to bury our experience and knowledge so that the Bush Illegitimacy can continue to run the Iraq war for decades for the benefit of the billionaires? So that they can continue to endlessly add other wars of aggression onto this one, murdering and maiming more and more US soldiers for money-power's empire? Do you want us to stop fighting for your rights? If we give up the rights of soldiers, will you allow us to ever begin fighting for any of our rights, freedoms, and liberties? (They're all made of the same stuff, you know. They're all held together by the "rule of law" that the Bush Illegitimacy thinks it lives above.)

Knowledge of constitutional law basics does little good for the ordinary soldier in uniform. You are obligated by the UCMJ to follow all legal orders from your superiors. We know that. We agonize for you. We honor valor. You can either trust those of us outside the military to both support your kill-or-be-killed situation and to fight for your rights at the same time -- or -- not, you know. We will carry on, whatever you think.

Stephen Neitzke
Direct Democracy League
http://ddleague-usa.net