Politics and the war

President Bush hopes no one will read political motives into his speech? Oh, my goodness gracious, heavens to Betsy where oh where would we EVER get such an idea? He's certainly never told us anything before that was politically motivated, has he? Well, he can certainly rest his little head easy on his pillow on THAT account. We'd NEVER think to put some nasty politcal motive behind something our President would tell us! And may a good and gracious God keep our wonderful President safe and give him a long, happy life!

President Bush is right saying we have to stay on offense regarding the war on terror.These people are evil,just like Hitler.You can't talk or negotiate with them...all they want to do is destroy us!
Carter and B.J.Clinton tried to appease them. Jimmy Carter wrote Khomeni love letters while americans were being held hostage. B.J. Clinton had about eight terror attacks under his watch and did n-o-t-h-i-n-g, but talk.
Thank God that when 9-11 happened we had a real man in office and not those two nitwits.
Paulo

Here we go again:

Frat Boy George W. is starting up his big lie machine for the fall elections.

It's disgusting how the Republicans are using the tragedy of 9/11 for political sway over the baptists in the South.

What W. won't tell them is that he was President for nearly two years before 9/11 happened.
When Bill Clinton was leaving office he told Dubya that his biggest concern should be tracking Osama Bin Ladin.
W. promptly blew off his daily briefings on Bin Ladin,and him,and Dark Cheney started their plan to fire up their hero Ronny Reagon's old star wars program.

Cowboy Dubya also has quit trying to tie the war on terror,to the war on Iraq.

So I ask you neo-cons,if Iraq is not part of the war on terror,than what is it part of ??

I hope the church goers think long,and hard before they jump out of their pews,and vote this fall.
Some of your own could become caught up in this phoney war in Iraq.
If you march into the voting booth,and vote Republican,you just may be sentencing one of your loved ones to death,and if that person dies in Iraq,what exactly did they die for ??

Think about it,WHY ARE WE IN IRAQ ???

George W. Bush will be out of office soon,but the people who die for his PERSONAL WAR in Iraq will be dead forever,and their loved ones will still be here doing time.

DONALD RUMSFELD-While answering a question from a soldier asking why the troops don't have the proper armaments on their vehicles.
"You go to war with the Army you have,not the Army you want.

DICK CHENEY-1)"The insurgency is in its last throes"
2)"We will be greeted as liberators in Iraq,they will throw flowers,and candy at our American troops"

George W. BUSH-"We must stay the course in Iraq"

AUGUST 31,2006
2636 AMERICAN TROOPS KILLED IN IRAQ

After Sept. 11, 2001, Bush said, he knew "the natural tendency for our country would be to hope that the lasting memories of 9/11 would be a fading memory.'' But another terrorist plot was just averted, he said.

How can it ever be a fading memory if he brings it up in his politidcal speaches every day?

It seems that daily this president lowers the bar of intelligence just a little more. And worse yet, he EXPECTS us to believe him. I am beginning to believe that this guy is not quite hooked up right or at very least completely out of touch with reality. Did anyone see his interview with Bryan Williams? The man actually out and out lied when he said that he never said Saddam was directly tied to the attack on 9/11. I am beginning to be offended by this guys revisionist form of truth telling because I actually think he expects us to believe him.

I don't know about you but I just can't remember a time when this goofball didn't tell a falsehood in the name of politics so the speech in SLC will likely be filled with more of the same.

Somewhere in Texas a village is missing its idiot. It's way past time for us to help this village to become whole again.

When did the president suddenly become concerned with the credibility of the United States? Didn't he alread shred it when he lied us into this war in the first place?

Bush isn't going to politicize the war? Oh sure, of course not. What did Rumsfeld say about critics of the Iraq war, that we can be equated to Nazi sympathizers? Yeah, that's me. Someone whose been to Auschwitz, seen mass graves of Poles machine gunned deep in the forests & a father who to this day still has nightmares of his home being ransacked by Nazis at gunpoint.
Other then this administration ridding Iraq of Saddam, haven't we kept up with the lies & or incompetence of the Iraq war? No WMA's, no 9/11 link, no money from all the oil Iraq has that should pay for the war, no short timetable for the war to end, no mission accomplished, etc, etc...
Has the US created stability in the Mid-East? Thousands of missles launched at Isreal from Hezbollah, who are supported by Iran, a country bent on destroying Isreal, & what was the outcome? Hezbollah is still around, being funded with billions of dollars for reconstruction from all over which influences other Palestinians for the Hezbollah cause & what does Bush say? Hezbollah has been defeated??
Good thing we have no exit strategy from Iraq, because the military is stretched so thin, that the US can't realistically confront real enemies, or terrorists.
But what do I know. According to the minority that is the conservative right, I'm a Nazi sympathizer.

This Mr. Bush has nothing else to talk about except the 'global war on terror'. He talks tough war talk but he has never seen real combat. He and others in his illegitimate administration are responsible for the diaster Iraq really is. He is responsible for all of the dead and wounded U.S. servicemen and the destruction caused to Iraq. Where are the WMD's he told us Iraq possessed?? I know I do somewhere have a photo of Donald Rumsfeld with a big grin on his face shaking hands with...Saddam Hussein. And then there's smarmy Cheney, a very earnest individual who also talks the tough war talk. Military experience for Cheney: zero. Drunk driving convictions: two. What a moral person. This coward Bush doesn't even has the descency to meet with families of dead servicemen who served in Iraq. He can't even speak good English. He sounds like a fool whenever he does speak.
Whoever the next president is really needs to reverse the course of destruction this president has put us on.

Yes John, I agree Bush should live a long life (behind bars)

I love that the President's response to a lousy Iraq policy is not to change strategy in Iraq, but to change the strategy for public relations and marketing of the Iraq occupation.

President Bush states "if we leave Iraq now it will shred the credibility of the United States." Guess what President; because of your misjudgements, miscalculations, bold faced lies and arrogance, the credibility of the United States is already shredded. Stop equating the fiasco in Iraq with the war on terror. There are no ties between 9-11 and Iraq. The only reason that there are terrorists in Iraq is because Bush and his neo-con's made it so.
Funny how a group of people, Bush and the neo-cons', love having the lower and middle class children of this country go fight and die for the Oil Companies and Haliburton and then have the audacity to dress it up as a "War on Terror". Shame on this President and Shame on anyone who believes his lies.

The President is exactly right. The islamic fundalmentalists faciscts want to kill us, they provide no differance to race, women , children, handicapped, or the elderly, if you are American you are a target and they want us dead.

Nobody likes war,we did not start this..they did and we have to finish it.. With a spine of steel and unwavering committment this President means what he says and says what he means...this is the reason we have not had any additional attacks on our soil since 9-11. Does anybody really think that would be the case if Al Gore, Hillary, John Kerry, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, and Howard Dean were given the reins on the war on terror. Think about it..

We can only defeat this evil from a position of strenghth, not appeasement.

JIM - "Think about it", have you ever stopped to consider WHY these people want to kill us so much? Do you think they just decided one day they didn't like our TV programs and declared a jihad? Why not dig under the flimsy surface of the "War on Terror" spin and find out what US big business has done to exploit governments, countries, and peoples not just in the Mid East, but all over the world (if not right in your own backyard). Don't let these puppets use ignorance and the ingrained mentality of high school football team rivalries to dupe you.

And for every person who declares that "We can only defeat this evil from a position of strength, not appeasement" (see you just parrot Rumsfeld's words), I expect to see your enlistment papers by the end of the week. Otherwise sign up for some diplomacy courses at your nearest college.

DD, when you try to reason with someone that kills innocent people for political reasons then you've already lost. The nearly 3,000 people that died in the World Trade Center did not exploit anyone. This blame the U.S. tactic is pretty reprehensible.

You have to understand that the jihadists goal is Muslim theocracy, like the one they put in Afghanistan, and they won't rest until they've achieved it. Anything "the Great Satan" did to them is just propaganda. It's sad to see an American use such Anti-American terms.

DD. So you think we can negotiate with these thugs, compromise and have them take away our freedom? Sounds like whatt France usually does. Wonder if that will change if Iran gets a nuke?It appears that you have not learned the lessons of history. Should I parrot the words of our enemy.. would that make you feel better. They want to destroy us.. kill us, and our way of life....

At least in WW2 the United States was united against our enemy. The terrorist want to split folks like me and you up..they count on it. They want us to try appeasment. Once we do; we put our guard down they will strike us harder than 9-11...

Double D,good post.Reported yesterday,CEO's from the top 34 Defense providers have made 1 billion in salary since 9/11.

War is great business for them.

Also,an Army pvt.makes less than 25k per year.

Seems it should be the other way around.

John E.:

I'll leave your opinions about Iraq to you. However, your math is off. Bush WAS NOT president for TWO YEARS before 9/11. On Sept. 11, 2001, he had been president for a little under NINE MONTHS. The election had been in November 2000 (remember, hanging chads, Supreme Court, ring a bell?). Bush was inaugurated in January 2001. Bill Clinton had been president for EIGHT YEARS before, and had done nothing to track down or kill bin Laden, despite the embassy bombings, the USS Cole attack, etc. The blame does not begin or end with Bush. A lot of you revisionists seem to want us to believe that Billy was some sort of prescient super genius. So, let me ask you this: If he was, and couldn't get bin Laden in EIGHT YEARS, what kind of success would you expect Bush, a "bumbling fool" (as you would have us believe), to have in tracking down and killing/arresting bin Laden in NINE MONTHS?

PIPE DOWN, RUMMY!

Poor Donald. More to be pitied than censured. Loyal factotum in the wrong war that he is, Rummy plunges mindlessly forward to bemuse war critics and delight the good old boys of WW2. His “Big Lie” tactic- combining dissimilar topics into a single genre- was perfected by the pathologically-mendacious Karl Rove. And branding Iraq war dissenters as Hitlerites is pathetic. It’s Rummy, Rove and Co. who’re emulating Herr Goebbels’ propaganda techniques. Poor Donald. May he emulate his idol to the bitter end..

Footnote: Joseph Goebbels (October 29, 1897 – May 1, 1945) was Adolf Hitler's Propaganda Minister (see Propagandaministerium) in Nazi Germany. Goebbels was known for his zealous and energetic oratory and virulent anti-Semitism. Following Hitler's death he served as Chancellor for one day. Afterwards, he and his wife drugged their children with morphine, and then poisoned them with cyanide. He and his wife then committed suicide.

JIM, if you go back and read your post you might realize that you're just repeating after Dick Cheney and Ken Mehlman. It's time to think for yourself sir.

FACT: Invasion of Iraq was in the current White House plans well before 9-11.

FACT: WH sold the invasion of Iraq to the Congress and the American People on the pretext of the imminent danger from Iraq's WMDs. You know exactly how many WMD were found in Iraq as well as I do - ZERO

FACT: WH changed the mission in Iraq to "bring democracy to the Iraqi people" (we're going to democratize you whether you want it or not, even if it kills you).

FACT: I've not read anywhere on this forum where a poster who objects to the current misadventure in Iraq also objects to the mission of ousting the Al-Qaida shielding Taliban in Afghanistan and stablizing that country. Why? Because we know right from wrong.

You know what sir? After considering the above, I'd take Al Gore, Hillary, John Kerry, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, and Howard Dean over the current occupant anyday. Once I honestly believed that he meant what he said, that he was a uniter not a divider, that he was going to lead this country to a clear, moral victory over Al-Qaida after 9-11. You know what sir? Unlike you, I know when I'd been lied to. And I won't accept lies from the same source again.

B.J. Clinton had about eight terror attacks under his watch and did n-o-t-h-i-n-g, but talk.
Paulo

Posted by: Paulo | Aug 30, 2006 8:58:32 PM

Paulo:

You need to go read a history book. When the attempted bombing of the World Trade Center ocurred in 1993, the Clinton administration hunted down the perpetrators, arrested, tried and CONVICTED them! Today they are rotting behind bars in jail. Compare that to Bush giving up on Osama bin-Laden so he can focus on his "nation building" in Iraq, a country that HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11, which Bush re-admitted in a news conference this month.

There were and are most deserving countries that support terrorism, like Jordan and Iran, that we should have made a priority instead of Iraq; however, those places don't have the oil reserves that Iraq has.

JIM posts: "With a spine of steel and unwavering committment this President means what he says and says what he means"

You mean, like that part where he vowed to get Osama bin Laden "dead or alive"?

Was our invasion of Iraq a mistake? Probably.

Did we invade because of a thirst for power or territory or oil or to finish the earlier war? No. We had bad information about WMD being in the hands of a madman who was unlikely to directly harm the U.S., but very likely to harm Israel and cause the U.S. to become directly involved anyway.

Should we withdraw from Iraq at once, leaving the new government to sink or swim? No. Iran, Syria and others in the region jump into the breech and we'd have bigger problems down the road than we have now.

Do those who hate the president think he and the V.P. are just looking to make themselves and their friends wealthy and take over the oil supplies in the region? Yes. That's what they say and they dismiss the matter of oil supplies as being "no big deal". If they knew what they were talking about, they'd realize that oil and Israel are the keys in the area and if oil were to be cut off, the economy of the U.S. would dive out of sight. They'd soon be making noises about invasions and take-overs of supplies once their life-styles became directly effectd. Not just high gas prices but no oil for gas or products made from oil and no gas to heat homes and businesses.

These are highly complex problems that have to be reasoned through by people who are rational and use the intellegence God gave them. If I was going to favor the opinions of the rabble who think they can solve the problems of the world by having the Democrats march into Washington and put their plans to work, I'd want to see the plans first. Until now, their only solution to all of our problems is to get Bush & Chaney out of office. Grow up!

Paulo, you say:

"These people are evil,just like Hitler.You can't talk or negotiate with them...all they want to do is destroy us!"

This is what Bush says all the time. You admit you've become brainwashed?

Your history knowledge stops at Reagan. Did it occur to you that a lot went on before? And Americans weren't always the good guys?

To Jim:

DD is right, you're just parroting the talking points of the Republicans. Explain how fighting in Iraq is doing our country any good? Where's Osama Bin Laden? Certainly not in Iraq. There was no terrorist presence when Hussein was in power.

I agree that Saddam was an evil dictator, but he was also a stabilizing force. Might I add, he was also a U.S. ally when he was at war against the Iranians.

We should've concentrated on Afghanastan. Now there's a Taliban uprising there due to lack of troops.

Think for yourself, Jim. Stop watching Fox and listening to Rush.

The Far Right of the Republican Party and the Selected Religious Right as "Keepers of the Morality" and "Keepers of Democracy against Terror" define "hypocrisy" to new levels. This President fights against any type of newfound stem cell research because of his "devout morals about the blessing of Life", yet he thinks nothing of bombing innocent civilians in Iraq and led the country in executions while residing in Texas - an achievement he openly smirked about in his first round of debates. The Christ that I worship does not believe in killing for oil and making sure that the select few rich get even richer. Everyone who "claims to be Religious and followers of Christ" that backs and supports this hypocrisy need to take stock of themselves and look in the mirror a little closer.

JIM, first of all if any one of the politicians you mentioned were in office, we would not be in Iraq and over 2,600 American young people would still be going home to their families.

JB,

Obviously you're a die hard neo-con who's watching the windbag GOP go down in flames,and I know, that frustrates you.

JB,READ MY POST CAREFOLLY,I SAID "NEARLY" TWO YEARS THAT THE BUMBLEING COWBOY WAS IN OFFICE BEFORE 9/11.

And another thing JB,BILL CLINTON IS NOT THE PRESIDENT ANYMORE,get over it.

I notice the neo-cons like you don't want to discuss Iraq......must ..be...ELECTION TIME!!!!

Why is it that anyone who disagrees with the Bush Administration's gross mismanagement of the war in Iraq is called an "appeaser" or a "cut-n-runner"? Because they are idiotic yet easy to remember sound bytes for the people who see only two choices: (1) continue the catastrophic war in Iraq, despite an insurgency that we seem incapable of stamping out (well, we really have NOT sent enough troops there to do the job, now have we?) and (2) surrendering to the "Islamo-fascists".

There really is alot of room for common sense in between those two ugly and extreme choices.

To quote FDR: "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself...". Yes, but since 9/11 we as a Nation have become almost completely motivated by fear, reasonable or unreasonable.

Paulo,JB,

WHERE IS OSAMA BIN LADIN???????

He sure as hell is not in Iraq,and he never was.

See Ya GOP,your rein of fake terror warnings scaring the people into winning elections for youself is OVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jerry Olkey Sr.,

Are you suggesting that we reward the republican led congress for doing a terrible job???

Are you suggesting that W's "STAY THE COURSE" plan is a good plan of action???

Stop rewarding these Republican Puds for doing a terrible job.

The Republicans in congress need to go,and the Urban Cowboy,Dark Cheney,and the Karl Roverats need to resign.

That's how change will begin Jerry.

To all of the defenders of appeasement and weakness:

Your hatred of President Bush is blinding your senses. If appeasement is the right course then why is North Korea have Nukes? Ask President Clinton. Why is Isreal and the Arab States still at war? Didn't Jimmy Carter get a Nobel Prize for fixing this? Then why are they still fighting? How many more innocent people would have died if we appeased or negotiated with Hitler?

What is more important... Finding Bin Laden or preventing any additional attacks on our soil since 9-11? How do you know he is still alive..By the why Prsident clinton had him in the cross hairs and chickened out. If so he is on the run living in a cave. Which if we did what you folks suggest we do, blame America, blame the President, and negotiate with thses souless, motherless muderers, thats what we will be living in... caves...
We had a taste of what Al Gore and his weak friends would do when America was attacked, they ran to the UN... Kofi Annan ..God help us.( He got rich on the scam for Oil deal with Saddaam.)

Who are you folks parroting other than the Liberal press, and the Democrats? You playing right into the hands of the terrorists. They want to divide us, so we appear weak and then they will attack. Lets negotiate right....
Unfortunatly you may get what you wish for....

More sick, deranged hilarity from John E. So, now Cheney is no longer Darth Cheney, but Dark Cheney?

Anyway, "nearly two years in office before 9/11." Sorry John E., but 8 months is hardly "nearly two years." It barely even qualifies for "nearly one year."

You are so full of rage, hatred, hysteria you sure as heck can't even think straight.

Jim,

North Korea has nukes, yes. And guess what? They were on Bush's "Axis of Evil" list with Iraq! Why did we not go after them? Likely because they can't offer us a vast supply of oil.

If we would have invaded N. Korea instead of Iraq and actually found nuclear weapons instead of a bunch of sand and a ex-dictator hiding in a spider hole, most of these postings from the "Loony Lefties" wouldn't be happening.

They wouldn't be happening because that would have been a war worth fighting, just like the war Afghanistan is. It's a shame our president decided to "cut and run" from that one, especially since the Taliban has once again risen to power in many parts and Osama bin Laden still has not been captured.

Not all people who don't agree with the war in Iraq disagree with the War on Terror. Many of them just want the guns to point in the right direction and the bombs to fall on the right people.

Slupee Boy,

Both of my grandfathers,my uncle,myself,and my son have proudly served "our" country in order to help Americans retain the freedoms that "we" all enjoy now.
We seved so that you may have the freedom to hide behind your keyboard,and spew hatred at people,and I'm proud that you are able to do that.

Think about that the next time that you try to sideswipe my military service.

You're welcome John D.

Bill and Jim,

So in order to be a good little American, you should:

1. Not question the policies and honesty of the your (supposedly) democratically elected (and Republican) officials

2. Not question the role corporations play in creating this worldwide environment of hatred and revenge

3. Not have compassion for people who have suffered as a result of 1 and 2

4. Rest smuggly in your American sense of superiority (i.e. ignorance, greed, intolerance) and blow up anyone who challenges it. (How many have died as a result of us 'bringing democracy' with bombs and guns to their country?)

I saw a bumper sticker on a brand new F250 the other day that read "Give War A Chance". Is that really what we are about in America? If so, this country will collapse in the very near future. Don't you dare tell anyone who speaks up and cares that they are "anti-American". Anti-fool maybe..

The invasion of Iraq is not a plan for protecting the U.S from global terrorism.
It was not then and never will be.
Its time to lay down the neo-con vision of nation building - it has only made matters worse.
The administration must get out of Iraq as soon as possible without leaving it in shambles. This might seem impossible because it is such an undeniable disaster at this point, but this is the U.S and with the proper leadership at the DOD, it can be accomplished.
At that point our resources will be available to
challenge the terrorists on the multiple fronts where they grow and multiply.

"challenge the terrorists on the multiple fronts where they grow and multiply".............

The Whitehouse would be a good start.

Jerry..you say was Iraq a mistake..probably!
We disbaned their army..their police...huge mistakes...yet you don't want to fire him?
you go make a mistake at work thats has a huge price to it and see how long it takes till your seat is empty!

Hey, John E., before you start nailing people for dispersing hate, you better look in a mirror. You, more than any other poster, spews the most hate.

You claim service, but evidence points otherwise. Also, in another post, I asked you where your son was serving in Iraq? What segment of the military? What squadron, group, division, battalion, etc.? How long has he been in Iraq? When did he join the military and why? How do you guys work it out that you are so anti-military and anti-war while he is over there? I asked, but haven't seen an answer???

And while i have not served in the military, my brother was in the Marines. He flew helicopters and was in Beirut in 1983. My dad was in the Air Force and fought in the Korean War.

To Bill R., John E. et al.
Wow, you didn't make it past the first sentence of my letter. Don't pick out one thought and try to make your case.

What are your comments about Israel as a target for Iraq under Saddam? What about their WMD, which most people thought he had; not just those in the U.S.? What about the need for oil to maintain our economy?

It's the popular thing to jab at Bush & Chaney as being concerned about the oil in the Mid-East. Leno & Letterman do it every night. Are you concerned about the oil? I am. I have no oil stocks and don't work for the oil industry, but I drive a car, heat my home, cook my food and use electricity every day. How will you accept rationing of oil supplies? Were you around when there was rationing? Look up the years 1941 to 1945 on-line or go to the library. Take what you read and muliply by 10 or 100 to see what it would be like now.

I say I have not heard any grand plan from any Democrat on what course to follow in Iraq, Iran, No. Korea or here that is different than what we are doing now. Neither have I heard a plan from any Republican who wants to take over from Bush. All I hear is a lot of noise being made to try to beat up the incumbents and get themselves into office.

Please stop the middle-school name calling and the cutsey comments. They prevent your ideas from being given consideration.

Jim,

I have seen you over and over again that the terrorists want to divide us, but by your own logic I thought they just wanted to kill us. The people who want to divide us as a nation is the Republican Party which, since the disputed election of 2000 has decided to rule on a 50.1%-49.9% majority, instead of uniting the country as Bush pledged incessantly in his campaign. Karl Rove's raison d'etre (I know, French... scary) is to rip this country in half, using every foreign policy decision, alas, every decision, as a cynical bludgeon to gain partisan advantage and wield power.

The nation was united after September 11, but that political harmony was shattered after the GOP turned the Homeland Security Bill an attempt to break unions and then campaigned agressively against Democrats who would not support such an unrelated excursion, one that would be wielded time and time again in the pre- and post-September 11 world.

The Iraq War II was rolled out as a marketing operation, as Joe Albough said, "you don't introduce a new product in August." It was clear that even the Bush team did not believe that Iraq had any relation to September 11, other than the impetus it allowed the Republicans to enact their unrelated, ultra-extreme agenda (economically, socially, diplomatically) unencumbered by the constraints of less confused times.

I'm not necessarily saying that the Cabal knew about September 11 in advance, but please answer me this: Isn't it convenient that the attacks against America on 9/11 allowed the GOP to enact a slate of policies that had been on their agenda long before September 11? (i.e. the Iraq War, a general curtailment of civil rights and access to information, and tax cuts, because we all know, if millionaires don't see their share of the burden of supporting our war efforts shrink even further, than the terrorists win)

Its easy to tell most of these comments are made by young, mostly brainless people.. They are a lazy, easily led , mostly ignorant generation, whose brains are warped by drugs and alcohol. They believe the lies of Michael Moore who broadcast on Hezbullah Radio..This group is one of the most radical anti American organizations in the middle east.. And Moore belongs to this...
Then you have Cher,, Sreisland., and the rest who tell these young idiots how to think.. Read a book called ,,Don't do as I do ,,Do as I say.. and these mindless young people follow this trash..
No party is perfect..Hey Gore owns and has for years more stock in Occidental than Cheney ever did in Halliburton But,, Hey,, he is a demo,, that makes it allright...You young people better wake up,,,Thanks