Would TB victim get in U.S. so easily as Muslim?

Is it really any shock that this guy, who took everyone on those flight's health into his own hands, turned out to be a sleazy ambulance chaser? Just like John Edwards.

When you have a physical description of a possible criminal - it is hard to ignore when seeing thousands of people each day. People of the Muslim culture are going to be under a more watchful eye than others - at least where terrorism and border security is concerned. That's just a fact. If, as a Customs agent, you are told to be on the lookout for a male suspect, are you really going to look at the females as closely? You may say you will treat everyone equally - but you won't.

A well-connected, wealthy white lawyer can do whatever he damn well pleases, even if he is infected with TB. Message received.

Everyone is upset about the people on the planes, but what about all the people he came into contact with in every country he visited?

His father-in-law didn't want to spoil his daughter's wedding day plans, so he used his influence. Hopefully, their special day didn't ruin anyone else's life. Time will tell.

Was he "racially profiled" to his benefit?

YA THINK!????

Maybe this episode will open people's eyes to how shallow and ineffective our much-vaunted Homeland Security system really is.

Remember, the motto of the Department of Homeland Security -

"Dying mecause of muslim terrorists is bad, dying for any other reason is no big deal"

The bigger question is- Why didn't the CDC offer assistance and safe passage back home to an American, if he was really a threat.

And to address your silly issue: It wasn't personal injury attorneys who blew up the World Trade Center on September 11 now was it?

The individual guard at the Canadian border was wrong to let someone in who had been flagged. Fire him. The guard can't do his job properly. I don't care if the guy flagged was a lawyer and maybe smoothed talked his way in, the guard wasn't doing the job he was being paid for; securing our borders. The guard should lose his job or at least be assigned someplace where he can't make decisions, because he obviously can't follow directions.

Give me a break!!!

I'm so tired about hearing how Muslims (American or not) feel so inconvenienced and upset about having to be profiled at airports. If you're that upset (as a whole) then do more to speak out against violence brought on by radical Muslims or hold some type of community relations event to promote awareness or something. Instead, they focus all their energy on complaining about how unfair it is to them and how their feelings are hurt and blah blah blah. Profiling is required. Period. Look at the FBI's list of most wanted terrorists... notice anything in particular?

That's not to say that all Muslims are suspects - CERTAINLY NOT! But then one needs to understand why they're being profiled. African Americans and Hispanics are profiled everyday driving down the street and it's hardly news-worthy.

Simply put, one's "feelings" is not protected in the Constitution, nor is it mentioned in the Bill of Rights. More importantly, one group should not given special treatment over another to simply prove a point. If a person or group of persons fit the profile of a would-be criminal, then understand why precautions must be taken. And if your feelings are hurt along the way, then see a counselor, buy some tissue or get a dog.

I read Frank James post with disqust! What the heck is wrong with targeting a group based on the fact that members of that group are killing Americans (and others whom they just don't like) and in fact have stated their intentions to kill Americans and destroy America and replace America's culture and freedoms with a culture they intend to impose upon the World? This aversion to "profiling" is idiocy!

Why do you think all Muslims are complaining? They aren't. In fact, some of them are happy to see more security, such as my husband. Last time he entered the States through JFK they took him aside for questioning because his name on his passport does not match the name on his green card exactly (in his country they use four names but immigration only put three on his green card). Was he upset about it? No, he was happy to see that they did take precautions. He explained to them why the names didn't match and they let him enter. But he would rather that happen then they let someone else with the same discrepancy enter without checking it out. Just like anyone else, he is happy to see illegals from his country get caught and deported. He respects the rule of law and doesn't like to see others breaking it.

Any safety precautions taken are for everyone's benefit, regardless of religion and national origin. If there were a Muslim terrorist on a plane ready to blow it up, he wouldn't care if some of the passengers were also Muslims-all would be equal victims. The same can be said of TB-just because it was a WASP carrying it doesn't mean it couldn't kill any of the other passengers, no matter who they are.

Earth to Frankie:
Who flew planes into buildings on 9/11? Muslims.
Who bombed the WTC in 1993? Muslims.
Who blew up trains in Madrid? Muslims.
Who blew up Bali night clubs? Muslims.
Who chopped off Danny Pearl's head? Muslims.
Who chopped off Nick Berg's head? Muslims.
Who hung U.S. service contractors? Muslims.
Who blew up the subway system in London? Muslims.
Who planned on blowing things up in the U.S. on Jan. 1, 2000? Muslims.
Who was caught planning on blowing up the Sears Tower? Muslims.
Who was just arrested for planning on attacking Fort Dix? Muslims.

Frankie, see a pattern here????

Why aren't we profiling Republicans? Clearly whoever was mailing Anthrax was a right wing lunatic. Only liberal media outlets and Senators received these letters filled with bio-terror. And folks they actually killed several innocent people. Yet Republicans don't speak out against these crime. In fact many Republicans say that there hasn't been any terrorism on US soil since 9/11 eventhough these terrorism acts happened afterwards.

So Johnny D, how far do you suggest we take treating all muslims, including citizens of the United States, differently because of those acts?

Internment?

Which part of equally protection under the law don't you get?

"Section. 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. "

Absolutely right. No Muslims or Mexicans entering the United States should ever be questioned ever again. Obviously, Mr. James has all the facts about the border crossing he needs in front of him to post this absurdly inflammatory hypothetical.

While I agree with John D and R U Kidding, I have to ask if Fundamentalist Christian Americans were profiled, would the outrage be so prolific?

who bombs abortion clinics? Fundamentalist Christian Americans
Who supports censorship? Fundamentalist Christian Americans
Who also is trekking the globe to spread the word of their beliefs in the name of missionaries? Fundamentalist Christian Americans (Catholics too)

Anyway, the sooner we realize theism is the problem and that fundamentaism is a broader problem than what is applied to a Muslim category, the quicker we can all move on

We have nothing to fear. TB is the disease of peace.

I'm sure if he had AIDS left wingers would have paid for his plane ticket, and the ACLU would be fighting his quarantine.

Not to excuse the Customs agent that let this man in, but this may be the dumbest article I've ever seen written! Did I miss where TB patients have been involved in blowing up buildings?? I'm not sure how you can compare the two, unless you admit that you have your own touchy-feely let everyone in agenda.

As far as "Muslims without any history of being a threat to the nation" being detained at the border, did the 9/11 hijackers have histories of threats, or did that attack blindside us?

Does anyone else see the nonsense in allowing people in to do whatever damage they'd like the first time, and only stopping them on the second try??

Posted by John D earlier:
"Earth to Frankie:
Who flew planes into buildings on 9/11? Muslims.
Who bombed the WTC in 1993? Terrorists.
Who blew up trains in Madrid? Terrorists.
Who blew up Bali night clubs? Terrorists.
Who chopped off Danny Pearl's head? Terrorists.
Who chopped off Nick Berg's head? Terrorists.
Who hung U.S. service contractors? Terrorists.
Who blew up the subway system in London? Terrorists.
Who planned on blowing things up in the U.S. on Jan. 1, 2000? Terrorists.
Who was caught planning on blowing up the Sears Tower? Terrorists.
Who was just arrested for planning on attacking Fort Dix? Terrorists.

Frankie, see a pattern here????"

The pattern is terrorists latching onto whatever means available to terrorize a people, nation, world. Now they latch onto Islam teachings. Previously, they were catholics terrorizing and subjugating the Central American peoples. And in whose name was Manson directing his people to kill.

All are terrorists, today more likely to be drawn from the pool of muslims, yesterday from Irish catholics and protestants. Any faith can be twisted into a killing directive.

who blew up Oklahoma City? White Man
what kids shoot up the high schools? White Kids
who had TB and infected passengers? White Guy
who has a HISTORY of racial prejudice? White Man
Who dragged and decapitated and hanged Blacks during the last 200 years? White Man
Who set off the bomb at the Atlanta Olymipics? WHITE MAN!!!

so go back to the backwoods and drink your old style while making out with your sister.

Yes, censor the Fundamentalist Christian Americans!

OK John D you need to wake up and stop watching the propaganda filled Fox news.

You forgot to add these to your list:

Unabomber - Ted Kaczynski terrorized the US for almost 2 decades

Timothy McVeigh & Terry Nichols - Oklahoma City bombings

Eric Rudolph - Atlanta Olympics bombing

Israel - bombed the USS Liberty in 1967

Basque separatists - have had numerous bombs prior to the Madrid bombings as well as after.

And don't forget acts of terror committed by the US:
- more than 650,000 Iraqis killed (more than half are children)
- agent orange in Vietnam causing thousands of massive birth defects and death.
- genocide of Native Americans
- slavery

need I go on...

This whole ignorant race-baiting piece is misleading. Get your facts straight before you start bashing the US buddy. Remember, this guy flew back from Europe to CANADA(!!!!) then DROVE across the US border, because he knew that if he tried to fly directly into the US, the customs/security people would have stopped him and threw him into quarrantine! Sheesh! If anything, this only shows that we need to strengthen our sutomobile border crossings and our cooperation with Canada and Mexico to ensure something like this doesn't happen again. Canada and Mexico need as stringent airport/border security as do we! Muslims have nothing to do with this. Gd help us when the bird flu develops, because this is exactly how an outbreak could spread to the US -- some selfish person trying to outrun a quarrantine line, sneaking into the country through a back door.

Octavian,
There is nothing wrong with old style. It is refreshing and reasonably priced.

How do we know what his religious affiliation is? What if he were a christian man of arabic descent? Are we profiling muslims or those of middle eastern descent?

A smart terrorist will wear a "I heart Jesus" t-shirt when he/she travels to avoid discrimination.

John Walker Lindh is a Muslim. But he's white. I bet he had no troubles getting on a plane.

Hakeem Olajuwon is a Muslim. But he's a 7-foot tall black man. I bet he has no trouble getting on a plane either, except that he probably has to sit first-class at all times because of the length of his legs.

When exactly did "Muslim" automatically conjure up beards and brown skin?

The problem with racial profiling is that people are bad at math.

Actuaries are allowed to take age, gender, etc. into account, because all the data is plugged into a computer and a thorough mathematical analysis is done, that properly weighs all the data.

But a single human being, with only a few moments to make a decision, is incapable of accurately factoring in items like race into evaluating threats.

There are over a billion Muslims worldwide. In America there are tens of millions of either Muslims or people of Arab, Middle Eastern, Central Asian, or South Asian descent, or people who might resemble them. The overwhelming majority pose no threat.

Human beings tend to overemphasize factors such as race and ethnicity, and in doing so overlook more important factors (like a flag for tuberculosis) in evaluating whether someone might be a threat of one kind or another. This is another reason why race should not be taken into account as a factor by human beings.

Or how about these terrorist organizations:
Black Panthers?
FALN?
Janet Reno and Bill Clinton?
Whacked-out far left environmental groups?
Left wing cop killers?
Democratic operative John Gacy?
Democratic judges who let child rapers off on parole or freed.

Really, I think ALl Leftist Loons and Muslims should be profiled, though I would evict vthe Leftist Loons from this country first. More Americans have been killed or injured by Loony Leftists than any group, including Muslims.

"If you're that upset (as a whole) then do more to speak out against violence brought on by radical Muslims or hold some type of community relations event to promote awareness or something."

Posted by: R. U. Kidding | Jun 1, 2007 9:19:09 AM

Still not one Republic has spoke out against sending Anthrax laced letters to perceived left wing media outlets and Democratic Senate leaders. All I hear is tacit approval. There also has been a strange silence about abortion clinic bombings and assasination attempts of abortion providers. Could this also be examples of the tacit approval R.U. Kidding was hinting at? In conclusion, profile Republicans.

As a Muslim I must thank the people who have the sense to see that race-baiting and Islamophobia have reached an all time high since 9/11, all of it unjust. I couldn't help but laugh at the audacity of R.U.Kidding. African Americans and Hispanics get profiled everyday he says. AND he doesn't ahve a problem with it. Get a grip! Since when do two wrongs make a right? I pray that those who are tuned into little else but Fox propoganda, make the effort to get to know some Muslims personally. As for those who don't feel Muslims have been vocal enough, remember 1) The Media doesn't always want to carry our opinion 2) Which newspapers are you reading 3) Listen to NPR or the BBC for some untainted news. Don't forget, a handful of corporations own most of the media.

While equating acts committed in the U.S. during a different period (native Americans), racist statements (Octavian) and insulting christians and muslims alike, perhaps those who are so far left and "tolerant" should review what "tolerance" means.
Muslims on the whole are some of the most committed followers oftheir faith that I personally have seen. It's unfortunate that this commitment has led to violence and the deaths of thousands, and that radical Islam is one of the most dangerous forces int he world today, but it is. Muslims will be profiled, that's jut a fact. There aren't very many "white guys" planning extreme terrorist action today and if one tallies all the deaths and injuries related to Islamic violence over the last several centuries it will still surpass any of the other non-Muslims mentioned in other posts, including christians if the crusades are taken into account or any supposed "U.S. terrorism" (whatever that is).
Radical Muslims kill people, lots of them, and they must be dealt with. If that inconveniences other members of the faith, our apologies, but we have to protect ourselves.

This is a very fair and valid question. As the Tribune and other news outlets reported the Border Patrol saw that this guy had been flagged as a public health threat and he should have been detained. The agent decided on his own that there was no need to detain him or cause any delays to those awaiting in line behind him to enter because he "appeared" healthy. His name came up in a database that said he should not enter the country and the Border Patrol agent let him enter because he did not "appear" to be sick. He should've been given MORE scrutiny than your average Muslim because ANDREW SPEAKER'S NAME WAS ON A DO NOT ENTER LIST. Why is that not registering with the people who are trashing Frank James?

A liberal lawyer who only cares about himself risks others lives for his own selfish interests. Where's all the "compassion" liberals seem to display now??

It's risk assessment Frank and it's highly appropriate. A bit inconvenient if you're a law abiding Muslim but frankly I find removing my shoes everytime I board an airplane a bit inconvenient too. I would rather see 100% of Muslim males between the ages of 17-40 subject to extensive searches rather than wasting security resources searching 70 year old white grandmothers traveling with their grandchildren. It's pure risk assessment and it makes sense.

indeed, if i have disrespected old style drinkers it is deeply regretted.

And I do not want to disrespect white people either, I am half white, proud American. But if all Muslims are terrorists, then it could be said that all white people are Nazi's. Hitler killed 6 MILLION jews, should countries that have jewish populations screen all Germans?

And to be honest there should be some screening of Muslims, I am born Muslim and I would worry about Muslims on an airplane with me. But if all you do is screen Muslims you are going to let others slip through the cracks. It is just a way to cover your behind by screening Muslims only, if a white person blows up a plane than officials can say "how could we have known?" but if a muslim does something than its "how could you not have known?".

>>>> more than 650,000 Iraqis killed (more than half are children)?

Frodo failed. George Bush has the ring.

[quote]
Octavian,
There is nothing wrong with old style. It is refreshing and reasonably priced.

Posted by: anon | Jun 1, 2007 11:18:06 AM
[/quote]

Where can you get Old Style in Chicagoland anymore? My local liquor stores haven't carried it for years.

Ahh, little minds always ready to bash a whole group of people. How about we focus on the issue of this turd carrying TB all over the place? He could potentially kill hundreds, even thousands of people. He was island hopping in the Greek Isles and was touring/site-seeing in Rome (millions of people there) and in Canada. Anyone who came into contact with him during his vacation has a risk.

There are too many places and too many people to even know.

John- I don't think the CDC knew when he was flying or where he was flying to, in order to arrange a flight for him. I doubt they would anyway, but that may be one reason.

This is a dumb line of argument. The fact is that around 90% of terrorists are Muslim. So obviously, when we hear of a terrorist incident, we assume that it most likely is a Muslim person committing it. Why is this so hard for the Politically Correct crowd to understand? It is just not Muslims, other groups get stereotyped as well based on past deeds. Too bad, deal with it. When Muslims condemn these Islamic terrorists openly and loudly instead of whining and crying about it, we might see some change.

Does anyone else think the more that John D posts, the stupider he makes himself out to be?

No, really, keep posting John D, I find it entertaining!

I see Raj is spouting the left wing blog lies that 650,000 Iraqis have been killed, with more than half of them kids.

Really, is there ONE Loony Lefty in this world with a brain?

The fact is, a Palestinian suicide bomber would have also been let through the border because he/she would be wearing a protective kuffiyeh over the face.

Matt M, fantastic point - and I couldn't agree more. Fundamentalists/ radicals... there all extreme in their beliefs and some go way too far in support of those beliefs.

John - Anyone that sends Anthrax to anyone else is a terrorist and should be beaten in front of their children! Ok, not sure about that last part but how do you turn Anthrax into a Democrat/ Republican thing?

Nadia K. - I don't even know where to begin... but I'll try.

"Islamaphobia?"
Dude.

"Since when do two wrongs don't make a right?"
Never, but that's not the point. The point is that profiling is required, like it or not. Who's more likely to snatch your purse, an 83 year-old lady with a walker or the 19 year-old guy standing between you and the door? As audacious as that last question is, it speaks of profiling and how it's something we all do instinctively. It doesn't make us biased... unless we're talking about someone who is already prejudiced at which point we shouldn't deal with them anyway.

"Get to know some Muslims personally?"
You don't know my personal life or what friends I keep. But I do - many.

"Fox"
I treat them as entertainment, not news. But the same goes for Al-Jazeera. I read the news more than I watch it. NPR puts me to sleep but the Tribune, BBC, Reuters, AP, and the Guardian are my favorites.

I do a ton of community outreach work - mostly with the impoverished, but occassionally with religious groups... and very rarely with victims of abuse (I just can't handle it sometimes). The point is that the religious outreach work draws very few people... but mention a rally about the unfairness or persecution of being profiled and... whoa!

Nadia, I really hear where you're coming from but I just don't agree with your take on it. I'm a Hispanic man born and raised in the ghetto. Do I live there now? NO! I was tired of getting mugged and beaten up so I moved and now me and my family live out in the sticks. How did I chose the area to raise my children? I profiled.

No wonder Bush is our president, the level of ignorance posted on this page is quite sickening, if not commical...

Being a Muslim American, I'm not complaining about this profiling one bit, it actually makes me feel safer. I get sent to the 'special' line every time I travel and I am fine with it. I was just sent to the 'red zone' at O'hare on Monday where they thoroughly questioned me. I've only had a couple of instances where customs officers were rude, but nothing I couldn't handle, they're just doing their jobs!

I don't see/hear of any Muslims complaining about this because contrary to belief, we too wish to travel safely around the world, but some of these comments here make you wonder where this country is headed. It's ignorant comments like these though that do make my blood boil though, but what can you do, ignorance is blisss...

Ahh, such "Christian" thoughts and attitudes we have. I bet Jesus would be so proud of his "followers".

Wait!! Is that seven lamps I see on the horizon?

R.U. Kidding has got to be kidding him/herself!

He's just as entertaining as JohnD. You both seem to talk out of your a$$es and still preach it as if it were the truth.

Here's a reality check: Just because uneducated tards like you say it/write it, does not make it the truth. Furthermore, just because you fail to recognize true common sense, doesn't make whatever hoggwash you're spewing a new type of common sense.

By your thoughts, how many races/religions would you burn at that stake? Seems like everyone that isn't you two. Keep posting though, you both dig yourselves deeper into a grave of ignorance every time. I LOVE IT!

;-)

R.U. Kidding- What would you do if it was the old lady with a walker that's hiding behind your door? That walker could be used as a weapon, LOL!

You profiled? So you trust no one? OR- it just seems you were too lazy to help set a good example and change the community you turned your back on. Oh yeah, you are definitely someone your kids should look up to.

Gaz- Outside of the "special" lines and questioning, how do you feel being prejudged as a terrorist? Example- many of the comments posted here.

I forgot to add-

Sanjay: 90%?? really? Show me your reliable source.

Gaz Halim, well said!

Whoever it is posting as George Dub you are truly disgusting. You mock a guy who posts here because he has the good sense to move to a better community...

and then you mock a Muslim who feels safer b/c of profiling, which makes us all safer...

WAKE UP! You truly must live in a reality suspended, left-wing fantasy world where all threats are created equal like old ladies with walkers! LOL!

I guarantee you are public school educated.

Another puddle of codswallop from demented John D

A fine trouncing by the Left.

"and then you mock a Muslim who feels safer b/c of profiling, which makes us all safer..."

Johnny D, this post is about a concrete example of profiling making us less safe.

By focusing on muslims as being the threat we lose sight of other, equally real threats.

Andrew Speaker was a white, upper middle class male. Even though his file was flagged as an actual threat, since he didn't meet the "Profile" (swarthy middle eastern man) he was discounted as a threat, and away he goes.

Profiling is lazy law enforcement.

We have nothing to fear. TB is the disease of peace.

I'm sure if he had AIDS left wingers would have paid for his plane ticket, and the ACLU would be fighting his quarantine.
Posted by: JD | Jun 1, 2007 10:23:20 AM

You really are sick JD. I thought I had seem some really vile BS spewed here but this one has got to take the cake. Maybe its just that your dim, so I'll try to give you a little enlightenment. TB is a highly contagious, airborne, potentially fatal disease. This Tool risked infecting everyone he came in contact with & you think this is something to joke about? Wish I could say what I really think about what you have to say JD.

Actually this was a great case of how profiling works. Was this guy a terrorist? No.

Did he have any ill intent? No

Was he actually a threat? No.

In fact his own wife hasn't even contracted TB in the 6 months since his diagnosis!. This is a case of how the CDC over-reacted by trying to lock an American out of the country, who was in all reality not a threat, and how they failed to do so.

"By focusing on muslims as being the threat we lose sight of other, equally real threats."

Clearly you don't understand the threat posed by Muslim terrorists who have delared war on us. I suggest we don't profile your flights and see how long you live in your self-made dream land.

You guys, this story gets even better. Get this, the TB ambulance chaser didn't even get married!

Mayor Angelos Roussos of Santorini, Greece, said a clerk from the municipality office informed him that Andrew Speaker and his fiancee, Sarah Cooksey, did not have the necessary paperwork for a civil marriage.

"He made no previous contact with the town hall about arranging a civil marriage," Roussos said. "So the wedding never happened. He stayed instead at a hotel for two days, the Majestic Hotel, before setting back for the United States. It was his first time here."

Roussos said he didn't talk with Speaker.

Now that this ambulance chaser's cover story is blown, what was he REALLY doing there? I generally concur with the posters that say TB is not the rampant threat that people like Lou Dobbs claim it is (Lou said on air that there were 7,000 TB cases in the last 3 years... the truth is 7,000 in the last 30 years, CNN has yet to run a correction). It's usually used by people like Dobbs as anti-immigrant race-baiting. But, Andrew Speaker is a different story. This guy's tall tale has more holes in it than swiss cheese.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/HEALTH/conditions/06/01/tb.flight/index.html

George Dub, I don't need to. If you want, you show me your reliable source that it isn't more than 90%.

"TB is a highly contagious, airborne, potentially fatal disease. This Tool risked infecting everyone he came in contact with & you think this is something to joke about? Wish I could say what I really think about what you have to say JD."

Hey dope, I know that , I was being sarcastic.

I'm tired of lefties trying to make pretend it's the end of the world because of the increased scrutinty on Mulsim's traveling to the US since 9/11.

Anyone see the ending of the movie "Twelve Monkeys"? Remember how a disease that nearly wiped out humanity was spread? Some lunatic flew around the world thru dozens of countries with nothing more then a few viles of a disease.

So go ahead & yammer either side of the Muslims are, aren't terrorists argument. Maybe someday, a disease like SARS will be transmitable from person to person. Then what? Look what happened during The Great Influenza outbreak in 1918 & how many millions around the world died before jet travel.

I'm sure Homeland Security is ready to save us.

Clearly you don't understand the threat posed by Muslim terrorists who have delared war on us. I suggest we don't profile your flights and see how long you live in your self-made dream land.

Posted by: John | Jun 1, 2007 8:31:59 PM

Tell you what John, I'll happily fly on flights that aren't profiled. As long as you agree to sit in the seat next to Andrew Speaker on every flight you fly on.

Ohh, and Jeff, it was leprosy that Dobbs was lied about, not TB. Wrong again, buddy.

Frank James,

Any comments on the Muslim terrorists arrested today for trying to blow up JFK airport in New York?

I'm sure you think that they were falsely arrested.

Mike wrote: "if one tallies all the deaths and injuries related to Islamic violence over the last several centuries it will still surpass any of the other non-Muslims mentioned in other posts, including christians if the crusades are taken into account or any supposed "U.S. terrorism" (whatever that is)."

I strongly disagree with you. You need to go back to school and re-take the history class. More people were killed by the white man than any other race. Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, King Leopold II of Belgium are just a few examples of white mass murderers from the last 150 years.

How many black people did King Leopold II of Belgium kill? This sick man enslaved an entire country (Congo Free State), his army killed between 8 million to 30 million African people. Just read wiki and educate yourself about all the horrors this white man did: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congo_Free_State

R.U.Kidding, man you should stop watching Fox and the right wing media machine, the start watching some respected and fair news channels.

I am strongly against terrorism by anyone, and killing innocent people is a crime. So I am not defending terrorists who falsely call themselves Muslims. Islam does not justify killing innocent people, and these al-Qaeda criminals are twisting the religion and misinterpreting it to justify their crimes.

Octavian, well said man. I agree with you that there should be some screening of Muslims. I am Muslim, and every time I travel, I am subjected to searches and too many questions. Even my 70 years old mother is subjected to searches at the airport and she is picked from the line just because she is wearing the Muslim head scarf. This is a fact of life, and I'm not complaining about profiling if it will make all of us safer. But if all you do is screen Muslims you are going to let others (like Mr. Speaker) slip through the cracks.

Not all terrorists are from Middle Eastern origin or have Muslim looking names. David Hicks, Adam Pearlman, John Lindh are all white and don't have Muslim names, so using racial profiling in their case will not work. Profiling is just lazy law enforcement.

Mr. Speaker was not arrested because he did not fit "the profile" even though the border protection computer system told the border guard to arrest him. This border guard should be fired, and we should change our procedures so that a single border guard can not override or ignore orders from border protection computer systems. This is a wake up call for all of us.

test

Just testing this for now

Tony- Your silence is deafening.

I guess its coincidence that they caught ISLAMIC TERRORISTS TRYING TO BLOW UP JFK to blind ideologues like you. You left-wing loonies are amazing.

Profiling. Learn it. Love it. Live it.

Brylun wrote:

"Frank James,

Any comments on the Muslim terrorists arrested today for trying to blow up JFK airport in New York?

I'm sure you think that they were falsely arrested.

Posted by: brylun | Jun 2, 2007 1:06:25 PM"

Yes, Brylun, I have a comment. Whether the men arrested in the alleged JFK plot are guilty or not will be decided by a trial, not by me.

Their arrests was apparently based on a lot more than religious profiling. While I haven't seen anything that indicates how law-enforcement authorities got on to this group, often times a plot like this comes to the attention of the FBI or police via a tip. That was the case in the recent Ft. Dix arrests, for instance.

What we know is that an informant started recording conversations of the JFK airport plotters in January. It may be that the informant was the source of the initial tip. Again, what I've seen so far doesn't answer the question of how the police learned of the plot.

The conversations the informant recorded apparently gave the police the evidence they needed to make the arrests. That's the way law enforcement is supposed to work.

It's a far more efficient, logical and legal process than stopping every Muslim or anyone with an Arabic name and submitting them to questioning in a find-the-terrorist-needle-in-the-haystack expedition.

Just as it wouldn't make sense to stop large numbers of white people after a hate crime in an attempt to the find neo-Nazis or white supremacists responsible, it's equally illogical to focus on Muslims just because they're Muslims.

That was, and remains, my point.

Frankie,

Blowing up JFK and Queens would be much worse than 9/11.

Another Muslim group... the religion of peace, right? One of this terrorist group is an Imam.

What is wrong with guys like you?

Islam doesn't tolerate dissent. Think Theo van Gogh, or Salman Rushdie, for example. This behavior is acceptable to the religion.

Did you see the percentage of American Muslims who say that suicide terrorism is acceptable? Around 70% depending on the circumstances.

How can you defend them, when Muslims themselves not only won't condemn this behavior, but support it in large numbers?

I suppose you are in favor of pushing Israel into the sea as well?

You're a piece of work!

Anyone at the Trib think to get a quote from John Edwards on this latest attempt to murder Americans?

Hey dope, I know that , I was being sarcastic.
Posted by: JD | Jun 1, 2007 11:26:24 PM

Sarcastic or not its still one of the must callous things I've read here. BTW: what does a muuslim look like? Where is the space that asks for your religion when you get a airplane ticket? Is it on your DL?

Another Muslim group... the religion of peace, right?

Some people say the same thing about Christianity when they look at the Crusades and their treatment of Jews. The perversion of faith, and the violence that it is related to is present in all religions.

It takes more than a poll and a notion that "suicide terrorism" exists to make a conclusion about a religion. Usually, a major catastrophe, especially a current one, is the wrong lens to be studying it from. You end up judging the actions of a few, and then using that as a measure against a whole faith.

Dear Mr James,
Thank you for pointing this sad reality out! My family members and I are frequently stopped when we travel. We are never impatient because of the delays, extra checks and questions, we have come to expect to be singled out though we Canadian and US citizens who have nothing to hide and no record or reason to be singled out. However, some of us have had to endure injustice, mistreatment and even violence in these checks, beyond the limits of the law. Worst of all, despite these extreme methods, people still get through... whether it's this man with TB, a reporter testing the system or people smuggling all kinds of illegal things, they somehow don't fit the "profile"... Muslims/Arabs and all people unjustly labelled are not asking for a blind eye, but just that an open AND JUST eye be turned to ALL those who pose a risk. Wouldn't that be more effective?

AR,

The Koran is full of calls for killing of non-believers (unless you are a dhimmi and pay tribute). Any Muslim who speaks out otherwise risks death (you have heard about Theo van Gogh and Salman Rushdie, right?). Islam is stuck in the 9th century. Islam today is taught just like Islam a thousand years ago.

Meanwhile, Jesus says to turn the other cheek. Christians today don't call for a Jihad. They preach toleration.

Belief in Islam transcends borders; look at the recent Pew poll to see that Muslims first identify as Muslim before identifying as a particular nationality.

If you are serious about defending Islam, then please show us where they preach toleration, peace, or anything other than killing non-believers.

Taheera,

Please tell all of us which of your Imams are preaching a message of peace and tolerance?

Today's headline from the Islamic theocracy in Iran: "Countdown to Israel's end."

What a distorted, violent religion!

Again, are there any Imams preaching a message of peace and tolerance?

"The Koran is full of calls for killing of non-believers "

Your problem is the fact you identified passages in the Koran that call for the killing of non-believers. What you fail to notice is that the Koran is interpreted by both fanatic fundamentalists, and moderates. Fanatic fundamentalist are the guys who would kill non-believers, the guys who call for jihads, and the guys who flew the planes on 9/11.

The same leeway of interpretation exists with Christians who may follow a literal interpretation of the Bible, or a contextual; where ultimately they arrive at varied interpretations of the work, and act it out accordingly in their lives.

"Meanwhile, Jesus says to turn the other cheek. Christians today don't call for a Jihad. They preach toleration."

Your other problem is the fact you are awfully selective in what you want to compare between both religions. Both religions have a history of perversions, and violence associated to it. One is no more peaceful yesterday, or today than the other.

Perversions. In this case, that means a group of people deviate from the norm of interpretation who chose to interpret their works of faith as a method to oppress a rival, or create a minority. Not so peaceful or tolerant. In the case of Christianity the Crusades, bordering on "jihad", and historical treatment of Jews are a good example. Jesus still stood for tolerance back then, but a group of people used religion to advance their conquests. Christianity also played a role in oppressing blacks in the South as they were looked on as heathens, and used to justify the violent dehumanizations they endured at the hands of whites. Not so peaceful or tolerant. If you want an example of TODAY'S perversion of Christianity try looking up the KKK, the National Aryan Nights of the KKK, Imperial Kans of America International Headquarters, etc. All identify Christianity as a founding part of their main doctrines. All of them are "God fearing," and all of them think that they have some divine right to feel superior to others. (Try reading some of their religious passages, and how their interpretation lands nowhere near Jesus's message). Historically violent in the US, but now more so in Aryan sects that exist abroad. All denounce people of color, " mutts," Jews, etc. Not much for Jesus "peace and toleration" message here either.

My intension is not to defend those who do kill in the name of a religion. But, unlike you, I do recognize that religion, yours, mine, that neighbors down the street, has a history of violence attached. That violence hinders not on who is the originator of the message, but who is the one doing the interpreting. Are we talking fanatics, or are we talking moderates. Jesus Bible hugging "God fearing" followers have killed in the name of God, and not all are tolerant. Muhammad's Koran hugging "Allah fearing" followers have killed in the name of Allah, and not all are tolerant. That fact they exist does not mean that the majority of average moderate followers did not denounce terrorist acts. If you did not hear these individuals speak out against the attacks then you were somewhere underneath a rock with your TV tuned into the vast majority of networks dedicated to unraveling the mind of a terrorist (fanatics), or those taking a a stand in defense of the attacks as a means to further their political agendas. Not moderates.

Well looky here you got your poll all wrong the poll says:

"The Pew Research Center for the People & the Press found in a national survey that nearly 80% of Muslims in the USA say suicide bombings are never justified to "defend Islam," but a quarter of those under 30 think such attacks are OK in some circumstances."

First off, first glance right? Is that how you read the poll? Probably how you got that "Muslims first identify as Muslim before identifying as a particular nationality".Go back and see your numbers are out of whack and context. Its 80 % of Muslims in America DO NOT justify using violent acts to defend Islam. And mind you the context we are working with is DEFEND ISLAM. In the context of a WAR in the Middle East I'm surprised that so many Muslims in America are so generous. The Middle East being a place where a majority of oblivious small minds like yours, that make up terrorist organizations, want to perceive this as a War on Islam, and not on the small radicals (terrorist organizations, again) who perverse religious teachings to meet their political agendas. It is a struggle I'm sure for the average Muslim having a small group, all the radicals and radical clerics, defining the religion of many within the Muslim faith. And, then having small minds like yours gobbling it up, and regurgitating information piece meal.

Secondly, do you know where that quarter came from ,the 30 %. Radical Islamics who live in the US. So you see it has nothing to do with the Koran or the actual religion. But it has a lot to do with radicals, fundamentalists, fanatics, and the reach of their interpretation etc. The attacks, and the response of the US had a lot to do with how popular those interpretations have gotten. Don't blame the religion, blame the select few radical interpreters.

"to see that Muslims first identify as Muslim before identifying as a particular nationality."

Really? Usually, thats how outsiders want to view the world. Why they fail to notice that being Israeli does not mean your AUTOMATICALLY Jewish. It is people in the US like you, who want to simplify everything in nice little boxes. The fact is Muslims all do discern differences among themselves. A Shia can spot a Sunni. An Iranian Shia can spot an Iraqi Shia. All Vice versa. They can tell the difference, and trust their nationality is flaunted at ever chance they get. But you wouldn't know that bc you can't even discern the simple results of a poll.

And, even if they do it is bc a natural dynamic occurs during a war. People tend to find a way to relate to the perceived victim versus the perceived aggressors to feel a sense of solidarity.

And, by the way "jihad" is not one of the official pillars of Islam; less so for the Sunni. It's interpretation varies if you ask a radical or moderate. "It can imply mean striving to live a moral and virtuous life, spreading and defending Islam, and fighting injustice and oppression, among other things." Although most scholars recognize that a physical struggle, violence, will somehow be involved against oppression. Most Muslims though see Mohammed's inner struggle as the ultimate form of fighting for Islam. See, just like the Crusaders realized physical struggles to spread and defend Christianity take a back seat to the ultimate struggle Christians, like Jesus, fight internally to keep the faith.

Guess which interpretation radicals on political agendas are following. The inner struggle most moderates relate to, or the outer struggle against oppressors like those idiot kamikaze radicals?

Grow up. Turn off the TV. Grab some books on the subject, and supplement what the the media covers with academic works. Preferably a mix of pro, con, and maybe consider the credentials of the people you chose to read.

brylun,

You stupid M****rF****r.

"Christians today don't call for a Jihad. They preach toleration."

Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, King Leopold II were all Christians or from a Christians background. These people are just few examples, and the list is long. How can you explain their actions?

So don't tell me that people who call themselves Christians or whites are peaceful people.

Tony, I apologize for getting TB confused with leprosy in that case. But don't you agree that Dobbs' comments are a part of a longstanding campaign against illegal immigration that he's waged on his show? Don't you think that CNN should run a correction for subtracting 27 years of reported leprosy cases? Do you concede it could have something to do with anti-Mexican racism? What say you?

Trib Folk, I would love to know how Democrat's post made it? Calling someone a "stupid M***** F*****" I would think violates whatever standards this blog has. Ooops, I am sorry, it's OK to name call with vulgar language when it's a F****** Loony Leftist and the target is a conservative or Christian, or as the LIBune and it's F****** loony Satan lovers like to call us "bible bangers or thumpers."

By the way, Democrat, most of those folk you cited were not Christian or from a Christian background.

Here Brylun. I found something for you, and any one else who thinks it is ok to lightheartedly use Muslim as the common denominator, and end up forming prejudice conclusions like "what a distorted, violent religion!" While your reading it consider that the dominant fundamentalist and radicals (aka militant Islam) make up for 20 % of Muslims.

I hope you TAKE THE TIME TO READ IT. Not like that poll you pieced together.
Koran a Book of Peace, Not War, Scholars Say
Peter Standring
National Geographic Today
September 25, 2001

Osama bin Laden, who is widely assumed to be the force behind the September 11 hijackings in the United States, cites the Koran, Islam's most holy book, as the inspiration for terrorist attacks. But Muslim scholars around the world who are reviled by such actions explain that the Koran preaches peace.

"The Koran is saying to humans, this is the final guidance from your Creator, for the specific purpose of worshipping him and creating a civil society where you can live in peace with one another," says Muslim scholar Imam Sulayman S. Nyang of Howard University in Washington, D.C.

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Muslims around the world rely on the Koran for guidance, says Nyang. Devout followers heed the call to prayer five times each day and recite passages from the holy book. Muslims believe that the Koran is God's unfiltered message—teaching them how to lead a good life and become a better, more moral person.

"The Koran is very specific with regard to the nature of human struggle, because in order for a human to be at peace with himself, they must control their baser instincts," says Nyang.

The quest to control base instincts such as greed, lust, and cruelty and to seek spiritual purity is known by Muslims as the "great jihad." Featured widely in the Koran, the "great jihad" is a person's most important internal struggle.

Nyang quotes Chapter 3, verse 172, of the Koran: "Of those who answered the call of Allah and the messenger, even after being wounded, those who do right and refrain from wrong have a great reward."

But also in the holy scripture is a reference to "lower jihad," a more earthly and physical—and controversial—struggle. "To those against whom war is made, permission is given [to fight] because they are wronged; and verily, God is most powerful for their aid," quotes Nyang.

This verse speaks of combat or war to be waged against one's oppressors—a struggle sanctioned by God.

But the Koran also states in Chapter 2, Verse 190: "Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loves not transgressors."

The essence of the verse, Nyang says, is to fight back "if you are attacked by your persecutors, but don't fight back indiscriminately. Follow the rules of engagement." According to mainstream Muslim clerics, those "rules of engagement"' are explicit: women, children, and innocent civilians are off limits.

Perversion of Text

Muslims believe the prophet Mohammed received these revelations directly from God some 1400 years ago. It was at a time when he and other Muslims were being driven from their homes, persecuted, and killed. But although the Koran advocates self-defense, its most prevalent message is one of peace and brotherly love.

"If people are intent on using religion to motivate terror or violence, they'll find an excuse there no matter what the actual text says," says David Rodier of American University in Washington, D.C., who is an expert on the world's religions. Like the Koran, he says, most holy scriptures are filled with stories of war and warriors, and these images have been used throughout history by some members of every faith to justify bloodshed.

"Religion, after all, speaks to our most basic and ultimate convictions, and if you are wanting to use violence, if you can find a religious justification, then you can find a very powerful motivation," says Rodier.

Christians have killed in the name of God, as have Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, and others. But it is Muslims who have most recently been accused of turning "divine commandments" into a divine license to kill.

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Terrorists have often said they are striking out against their enemies and oppressors "in the name of Allah." But many Islamic scholars say such terrorists are not only violating the spirit of the Koran, but the letter of it as well.

"You do not kill innocent people, you do not cheat, you do not lie, you do not destroy any property of other human beings," says Imam Abdullah Khouj, an Islamic scholar and director of the Islamic Center, in Washington, D.C.

The attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon "can't be in the name of Allah," he adds.

"Violation of Allah's Wishes"

Islamic scholars interviewed by the TV news show National Geographic Today agreed that terrorists such as Usama bin Laden and his supporters are fanatics using Islam to further their own worldly causes.

"In order for them to generate support beyond their small group, they have to latch onto universal symbols, and this is where Islam becomes a target of convenience for them," says Nyang

People combine pieces of verse from the Koran and use it to justify their actions, says Khouj. "But to understand the full meaning of the verse," he says, "you have to read the one before it, the one after it, maybe five to six verses to get the full picture."

The "full picture" of Islam and the Koran, say Khouj and Nyang, is captured by Chapter 5, Verse 32: "[I]f anyone slew a person—unless it be for murder or spreading mischief in the land—it would be as if he slew the whole people. And if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people."

For most Muslims, the callous and indiscriminate taking of human life violates Allah's wishes. It defies the Koran's central message and undermines the peace that Islam promises to deliver to all people.

"Human life in Islam is extremely sacred," says Khouj. "We're not talking about just Muslim [life], but human life in general."

This article was excerpted from a one-hour special, "The Geography of Crisis," aired by the TV news show National Geographic Today on September 25 at 8 p.m. EST.

The left's stance on this reminds me of the old joke where someone is looking for something in one room even though they lost it in another room. When someone asks them why there are doing so, they respond "the light is better in here"

What is wrong with you people?

"Tony, I apologize for getting TB confused with leprosy in that case. But don't you agree that Dobbs' comments are a part of a longstanding campaign against illegal immigration that he's waged on his show? Don't you think that CNN should run a correction for subtracting 27 years of reported leprosy cases? Do you concede it could have something to do with anti-Mexican racism? What say you?"

Jeff, don't misunderstand, I wasn't defending Dobbs in any way. I think his xenophobic fear mongering sucks. I was only trying to correct the record so as not to minimize the seriousness of TB as a public health risk.

I don't know if you saw it, but Dobbs had a commentary up on CNN's website last week addressing the leprosy thing and basically saying "I was wrong, so what?".