Catholic bishops: Remember abortion in 2008

Go figure, the Catholics want to control everyone's lives right down to their inner most beliefs. "If you don't follow what we tell you, then you're not a true Catholic." They're like the Americans who say that you aren't "patriotic" if you don't support the President and the war. Geez, when can we start feeding them to lions again?

The date on this might be 1757 instead of 2007.

I really wish these men would keep their church and beliefs out of government...or PAY TAXES to help take care of these children they insist women have. If they're so concerned why aren't they out there supporting universal healthcare? Why aren't they out there supporting the use of condoms? It's time to tax these people. Religion has all the mouth but shows no money when it comes to someone else's life. I'm sick of it!

Funny how they didnt say - remember we hid child molestors...... the catholic church is on the way out.

The right to life/natural law is one of the most important things in the Catholic faith.

If you don't agree, that is your business. But Catholics can't go around voting people in or keeping candidates that accept such a heinous thing as acceptable.

We have to have some ideals.

Remember abortion in 2008 but I guess forget elective wars, denial of health care and sub-par education.

It is obvious that the Bishops don't actually care about life.

I really wish these old trolls would keep their religious beliefs out of my life I am not a Catholic nor do I request their beliefs to be forced on to me or others that are not affiliated to their religion or any religion. I do feel they need to keep their religious views in their church and not in public.

Catholic Bishops: Remember pedophilia in 08. Worry about cleaning up your own mess and stay out of politics.

I Agree one hundred and ten percent with TJWilliams post. I also have had enough with religious intrusion into my personal life, they should be taxed at least fifty percent and use that money for the poor, the sick and all others in need and not religious greed, that is what true religion stands for. I hope the pope gets a clue as well as the rest of the worlds clergy

the catholic church: the crusades, the inquisition, habitual child rape, nazi profiteering.

the largest organized criminal conspiracy in the history of homo sapiens. and the cleverest aspect is that their faithful are not allowed to criticize -- nor are the rest of us.

when the man in the pointy white hat sits in one particular chair, he can, by rule, do no wrong -- none.

If the right to life isn't protected, none of our other rights have any meaning.

Odd, shouldn't they say, "Don't forget about the death penalty," as well?

Isn't the death penalty just as much of a no-no as abortion to the catholics? Yet you never hear about it, why is that?

Why does the media persist in giving the catholic church so much press? Don't they realize that there are very few people (even most that consider themselves catholic) that really care about what the shriveled-up catholic "leaders" have to say about ANYTHING? I generally do the opposite of what the catholic church preaches.

gary h.:

i agree with your sentiments, but unfortunately it’s naïve for us to think that zealot catholics (among other frenzied religious nutcakes) would elevate constitutional principles above religious principles.

it’s the reason people feared electing kennedy in 1960 -- they thought he would put the pope ahead of the constitution.

we’ve learned that a majority of american catholics are sufficiently rational to not conflate the church with government. but far too many are incapable of this intellectual excercise.

Catholics cannot continue voting people in who have done such a heinous thing as going to war with Iraq. How many innocent people have been murdered?

Let the Catholic church stop telling people how to vote. The majority won't listen anyway. Most Catholics today accept what they want as far as teachings, especially in the use of birth control. The Catholic church forbids artificial means of birth control. Now how many people adhere to that one?

The message from America's Catholic leaders was meant for Catholics. If you are not Catholic, than don't listen to it if you don't want to.

I think their message is critical as we go into another election cycle. While there are many important issues, the basic right to life has to be a top priority and not just one issue among many. Without life, all other issues don't matter. They do go on to say that neither political party is ideal for Catholics - see the last 3 paragraphs of the article. I think that a pro-life Democrat would easily win the Catholic vote.

By the way, Catholic teaching is strongly against the death penalty in almost all cases. Many Catholics have taken the lead in fighting the death penalty as we have against the killing of innocent babies through abortion.

I'm not religious, but I respect other's religious viewpoints.

It is his church and if he wants to set its ideals he can. Those who don't want to adhere to them should form their own church.

this is a perfect example of how the catholic church has lost touch with today's followers. If they are getting into the political debate, the church should begin to pay taxes.

It is truly sad that so many choose to focus on what might be wrong with the Catholic Church instead of what is right with the Catholic Church. Think of all of the hospitals, schools, soup kitchens, social service agencies, and other institutions that the Church has blessed us with. Think of all of the hope, direction and spiritual fulfillment that so many get from the Church. And so many of you choose to find fault because the bishops choose to take a moral stand? You don't have to listen to them, but please respect their right to guide their faithful.

jim w.:

my problem with the god-people version of "right-to-life" is that the church thinks a microscopic collection of cells is a person.

they believe this biological absurdity ONLY because the church teaches them that a man, living in the sky, puts a "soul" into an egg at the moment it’s breached by a sperm.

this line of thinking manifests itself in condemnations against masturbation -- which is also wasteful of potential life -- and therefore prevents more catholics from being born, and subsequently coming under the jurisdiction of the church.

and these condemntations of masturbation result in a lot of emotional troubles in young people -- and a lot of pent up aggression in young men -- which aggression manifests itself in rape, wilding, and other anti-social behaviors.

also, homosexuality is condemnded. so men who identify themselves as gay are forced to remain celibate -- and to not masturbate. historically, the most useful place for celibate catholic men is the priesthood. and that’s where the church sticks them.

no one should be surprised by the logical outcome of forcing pent-up gay men into the priesthood. bad policy usually produces bad outcomes.

The right to life/natural law is one of the most important things in the Catholic faith.

If you don't agree, that is your business. But Catholics can't go around voting people in or keeping candidates that accept such a heinous thing as acceptable.

We have to have some ideals.

Posted by: nick | November 14, 2007 1:00 PM

This is not the only moral issue that Catholics need to consider.

If a Catholic, such as myself, was to vote based on church doctrine. Then to be a "good" Catholic, you would need to find a candidate who is:

-Against the war in Iraq
-For universal health care
-Against abortion rights
-Against the death penalty
-Pro-immigraton reform (including some amnesty)
-and against gay marriage

Good luck!!

Good job by the bishops! The Bishops conference has spoken on health care, immigration, the death penalty, etc. Please take some time and go to their web site and check it out. However the right to life trumps all those other issues, if you were never born how does health care apply to you or the death penalty or the war?

Boy, there sure is a lot of hatred for the Catholic Church. It is called freedom of speech. Hey, if you’re not Catholic it doesn’t really apply to you. If you are Catholic, please take some time pick up a Catechism and try to understand why the Church teaches what it does. If after doing so you still don’t agree feel free to join another church, there are plenty of denominations out there. The Catholic Church has been around for 2000 years and it isn’t going anywhere.

Write all you want that is disparaging in your remarks against the Catholic Church. Christ said blessed are you who are persecuted for my sake. So, may all Catholics welcome the opportunity to suffer true persecution for their beliefs, for our reward in heaven will be great, indeed!

There's a big difference between a "right to life" and an obligation to die. Unfortunately, our "pro-lifers" -- Catholic or not -- can't seem to grasp this difference.

Thus, syrupy, maudlin sentiments like "Without life, all other issues don't matter" (Terry) or "If the right to life isn't protected, none of our other rights have any meaning" (Jim W) are so over-the-top as to be farcical. No one is suggesting that killing fetuses is a requirement or obligation (c.f., gay marriage -- if you don't like them, don't have one --it's not a requirement).

While I'm at it, I'll throw out something that may be perceived as inflammatory/inhuman -- fetuses are replaceable. Period. Just like kernels of corn or blades of grass.

When it's all said and done, women in our society seem to bear something along the lines of 2 or 3 kids each. Families seem to gravitate to that number regardless of whether it takes extraordinary fertility treatment to build up to it, or, at the other end of the spectrum, abortion/birth control to get down to it. So the fact that a woman has an abortion does not mean she'll never have a baby. Not only is she likely to have her 2.5 kid "normal" share (in statistical sense), but that abortion effectively opens up a place for a future kid that would have been averted by birth control.

Them's the facts, folks. The Catholic Church/anti-choice parade of maudlin horribles is make believe.

don, your post -- so far -- is the most ludicrous.

"Hey, if you’re not Catholic it doesn’t really apply to you."

this is the crux of the problem: the catholic bishops actively seek to apply it to us. that’s why they’re telling their sheep to act at the ballot box, and not within the confines of their own lives.

it’s not good enough to make personal choices, or have freedom. they want to tell us what to do with our bodies. they seek to impose their will on us, via government.

you just don’t get it, do you?

It's as simple as, you can't molest an aborted boy.
I understand there's a shortage of alter boys these days.

This should be their theme song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DkqU-uWojc

The catholic church can preach all they want towards their own followers - most of whom ignore them and do the opposite anyway. It becomes all of our problem (including us non-catholics) when this huge no-tax-paying corporation begins to use their influence to impose their beliefs on the rest of us via politics such as in this case. THAT my friends is wrong and should not be tolerated. Do you all realize how much property tax revenue in ALL of your communities is lost due to the church exemption law? Talk about violating the seperation between church and state.

While the church in the United States did a very poor job in handling the abuse crisis that doesn’t mean it should not make any statements on any moral position. If they were to do so, they would be held accountable for another issue – silence regarding abortion.

If racism becomes rampant for example, they should shut up because they need to clean up their own house first? Or do people bring up this issue because they disagree?

People were upset by the cover up and rightly so. An Associated Press report showed that in Public Schools in the United States a “seven-month investigation found 2,570 educators whose teaching credentials were revoked, denied, surrendered or sanctioned from 2001 through 2005 following allegations of sexual misconduct.” As opposed to the majority of priestly abuse that took place 30-50 years ago. Where’s the outrage? How come it's not all over the media?

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5h28LEG90GGTAaEOfdBPKwb5kXdawD8SD5OJO0

So do you think that someone such as Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton should be quiet? How come no one talks about separation of church and state when they run for office or tell their congregation how to vote?

Rob,

Thanks for the reply.

It’s interesting that if I watch a program on TV which I think is offensive to the Church or offensive at all people will tell me “If you don’t like it, don’t watch it.”
But here is a statement for Catholics and many of the same people who would say “don’t watch it” tell the Church to shut up. That is why my previous post said
"Hey, if you’re not Catholic it doesn’t really apply to you."

What happens in the confines of a person’s life should be reflected at the ballot box. If I am against racism, I am not going to vote for a racist, if I am for gay marriage I am not going to vote for someone who is against it. If I am an environmentalist I am going to vote for a candidate who reflects my views.

People have the freedom to vote for whomever they want. The Church isn’t forcing anyone to do anything. It is just reminding a generation or two of poorly catechized people about morality. Just like the Sierra Club might make a statement before the elections reminding them of all the important issues.

I think the crux is that people don’t agree with Christianity and they want it silenced because it doesn’t fit their views.

One of the sheep named Don

The Catholic Church is not about United States politics. The stance of the Church is based upon the teachings of Christ and reaches beyond wordly bounds. Every person within the Church is a sinner just as every person outside of the Church is a sinner. The Church being full of sinners does not detract from the teachings of the Church. The teachings of the Church are holy instructions from Christ. The Church believes in helping the poor, the sick and right to life. Refrain from listening to 5 second blurbs on the news and read the writings of Pope Benedict. You will find a man that is full of love and generosity just like Jesus. A man that cares about his fellow man not just in this world; but, also in the world to come.

God Bless you Don for your wise words and defense of the faith. You are a light in a very dark word (see most of the posts on this wall).

To many of the rest of you, I'm sorry to burst your bubble but the Church isn't going anywhere. That being the case, the bishops are wise to continue to guide their flock in world that values death over life, choice over truth, and feelings over morals.

The Church isn’t forcing anyone to do anything. It is just reminding a generation or two of poorly catechized people about morality.
Posted by: Don | November 14, 2007 4:56 PM

Wow, you need to read up on the history of missionaries. Native peoples brutalized over their views of "morality". And still we have poor women in less developed countries (and even yet here) that are relegated to being breeding machines while not being allowed control over their bodies or to attain the same positions in the church that men do. What a boy's club.

Churches can NOT preach politics from the pulpit. If they want to then they must give up their tax-free status and pay taxes, and stop being supported by taxpayers. The U.S. is NOT a godless nation. The separation of church and state in America means the state cannot sponsor, mandate, or support any religion. America was founded on Judeo-Christian principals and the laws of the nation and states are based on the Ten Commandments. The government in America is the citizens; it’s not a separate entity from the people. The government must remain secular, as all religions are a dogma. See http://tinyurl.com/2znnvl

Why is it when the Methodist leaders were calling for the US to get out of Iraq a few days ago, no complaints from the libs about the church butting out? However, when the Catholic bishops speak out on the opposite side of the libs, the left goes into a seperation of church and state.

So, when do we get to start feeding them to lions again?

Protecting human life is not the sole province of Catholics, Christians or people of faith. Protecting human life from conception to natural death is simply respecting the founding documents of this nation and upon which this country was founded. It isn't religion that tells us hat is or is not human, but science and medicine. But the law must be applied evenly and protect all persons, that is all human beings. If government can take away the right to life, then all other rights are in jeopardy.

As for the bishops, they have a lot of work to do cleaning up their own house, but simply because they have much to do should not preclude them from taking a moral position and inviting everyone to consider the reasonableness of their argument.

I commend the people that have said positive things about the Catholic Church, your heart really beats a true and loving beat. This issue deals with not only all Catholics but with all human life. Abortion hurts all life. It kills the child, it hurts the mother and father and weakens the family and country. It would be great if even the non-Catholics read the full letter that the Bishops have written. Human life starts at conception and jumps for joy in the womb as John the Baptist did. I pray that we may turn to our Mother, Mary and ask for guidance in these situations so that we may speak to one another lovingly about these issues and that all people support life in all stages.

"It is a poverty to decide that a child must die so that you may live as you wish." - Mother Teresa