It was amnesty.
Was anyone to go to jail for their crimes? Nope.
And the "punishment" was a slap on the writs.. a real farce.

Amnesty: the act of an authority (as a government) by which pardon is granted to a large group of individuals.

McCain instead of requiring illegals to leave getting in line for citizenship in the legal manner, he supported a provision to let illegals stay granting a type of amnesty. All the illegals had to do was fill out citizenship paperwork and pay a fine that probably would not be enforced anyway and the illegal would be allowed to stay.

That is amnesty.

Shame on Lieberman and McCain for not addressing the issue but instead childishly getting personal.

McCain is like all pols trying to weasel out of his record. It was amnesty and and he is to chicken to admit it! Guess what will happen if he gets elected?

The "Z VISA" was part of the
final amnesty bill. The z visa was open ended and allowed aliens to stay indefinently.

Mitt has been making this point since the first debate.

The McCain bill allowed the illegals to stay, forever, period. THAT'S AMNESTY!

Romney said there were reasonable provisions when three versions were being bantied about, including Sen. Corbyns version.

Romney never signed off on this final version!

Therefore, it is Lieberman and McCain who are lying!

ajarizona

What is wrong with America? Why are we even discussing anything short of locking up or expelling law breakers. Is the issue really that confusing? Any society fails to execute its laws eventually will degrade to having no laws and thus no protections. These gutless politicos are just hedging their bets these days against a new growing constituency of illegal aliens and what they don't realize is that they are going to eventually lose the confidence of their citizenry and certainly those immigrants who worked to obtain residency or citizenship.

McCain is a good man, for sure, but soft on illegal aliens and definitely soft on torture. I don't care what his personal experience was as a POW, if it still afflicts him and impairs his judgement, then maybe he isn't fit for public office, or at least not the oval office where tough decisions have to be made.

Both Mcain and Lieberman are too old and delusional to understand that their immigration bill was amnesty!!! Life long politicians. Life long liars.

John McCain and Ted Kennedy composed this amnesty bill and we all know how Ted Kennedy loves to pardon the illegals. John McCain voted for amnesty - he can call it what he likes. A candidate who chooses to twist the truth should not be our President.

Just to be clear, McCain and Lieberman are among my favorite senators. I think both are good men. Lieberman in particular should be cheered for his courage in breaking with party ranks. And McCain is really a class of gentlemen to be hailed as a hero.

HOWEVER, McCain's record is really spotty in the area of good decisions. He voted against the tax cuts (by now, proven to have propelled the US economy way beyond the Clinton boom years), his name is on the campaign finance reform bill that impinges upon constitutional rights of free speech, and the Amnesty bill that stalled in congress is the last testament of his legacy.

My big issue with both of these gentlemen, and most of today's politicos is that they've backed away from taking a firm stand in defending the law. I DON'T like Ron Paul, but find more and more that his position on some of these issues resonates. Mitt Romney is another who has made strong mention of the rule of law (and don't bring up the BS argument about his yard service subcontracting to illegals - as an argument it doesn't wash).

Romney's ads have been misrepresentative of the facts, and in some cases, blatantly dishonest. Several news outlets have commented as such, so those that are sticking up for them need to get their facts straight. McCain will win because he the better leader, and the better man for not resorting to such dishonest methods to get elected. I'll be happy when Romney is finished in this race.

Jason, I respectfully disagree. Romney's ads have not been blatant, just brief. The jist of his message is the same as my concern of McCain (and Guiliani too) being too soft on immigration and even when called on their records, they can't (won't) satisfactorily rebut that. If McCain is going to be strong on upholding immigration laws, he should just come out and say it instead of creating an imbroglio of third party accusations through Lieberman.

It sure WAS AMNESTY
And McCain STILL does NOT get it!!
He is a traitor and ready to sell out the sovreigntry of your country. If you agree with that go ahead and vote for him. Meantime he wants Americans to fight in Iraq whilst he gives their country away to any and all comers......
he is a SHAMNESTY traitor!

Mary, while I don't disagree with your statement that McCain supported an amnesty bill, I do take exception to the vitriole of your traitorous accusations. Comments like that put a quick end to useful debate. He may compromise and even capitulate on some points of sovereignty, but calling him a traitor is over the top. Clinton, who allowed his buddies at Loral to sell rocket trajectory and stabilization technology to the Chinese, now that was traitorous, not to mention the denigration to the office of president that came from perjury and his oval office indiscretions.

But to the point, McCain's not a traitor, just a politician. He belongs in the senate and not in the White House.

John McCain and Joe Lieberman are just plain lairs, period! Amnesty is when illegals aren't arrested and deported. What American in their right mind would want to import Mexico's poverty. We have 40 million Americans already living in poverty and don't need or want 20 million+ illegal criminal welfare aliens to over run our county and social services, period!
Let congress know we want our immigration laws enforced and our borders secured!
dan bergstrom...
seattle, wa...

Mary,
Your right on the mark! America has been invaded by Mexico's 20 million criminal welfare illegals and McCain and Lieberman have let it happen. Yes, they are traitors for not defending America's borders!
dan bergstrom...
seattle, wa...

And just who is going to care for Mitt's lawn? Surely he can't be expected to pay legal wages, can he?

"There was no amnesty in our bill, it was a path to citizenship and punishment for illegal behavior. It was never amnesty."

McCain then went on to propose a stiff $50 penalty to be imposed on bank robbers in lieu of prison time.

Romney's ad pass scrutiny for being fact based. Just because they don't give their opponent's rebuttal or nuanced explanation ("technically, according to my definition, amnesty is..."), doesn't mean the add is dishonest. I consider what McCain tried to do Amnesty after having discussed the matter with several immigration lawyer colleagues. We truly are at risk of losing our culture, language and sense of unique American identity to the hordes from the south. I have many hispanic friends, enjoy their culture and company and also like to visit Mexico, but I don't want my country turned into Mexico. There really are enough willing to come here to have that happen in my lifetime. Ask Canada/French Quebec about the division it has caused to have two languages being spoken--it has, and is, nearly ripping their country in two. They don't even have a cultural divide--only a language divide--and it is tearing them up politically and socially. I am tired of calling a state agency or business, waiting through a bilingual message only to be told to "push 1 if I speak Spanish and 2 if I speak English. Only Romney has the trust of business and and the ability to reach across the isle to solve the immigration problem.

Romney's mistake was not to fire the lawn service company the first time. He was too kind to give them a second chance.

But it is ridiculous to expect home owners to interrogate contractors for illegal workers.

As a life long Democrat and liberal I have never been more excited or proud of my party! I believe Hillary is the past and Obama Hussein is the future and the leader of the Democrat Party! I think he can bring many more under the Democrat tent and make it the party of the future in the USA . His experience as a Black Muslin can bring the Arab Islam Muslins into the Party as well as the Black Muslin Islam Nation and expand the Democrat party. Already we can see Islam Nations around the world are embracing his candidacy. His strong Compassion stand for Illegal Immigration should bring the Illegal Immigrants into into our camp. Indeed, all immigrants from around the world that want to immigrate to the USA but do not want to go thought. the hassle of legal Immigration will support us. Finally American can live up to its creed under Obama and Citizens of the world irregardless of Religion, Race, Nationally, Education or Skills because anyone can come to American and be citizens of this great Nation and the Democrat party! There will never be the hateful racist term of Illegal Alien again! Our growing and expanding population with our teeming masses will allow to us compete with China, India and other third world countries and end outsourcing of our jobs.

It may require a balancing act having both the Blacks and Latinos under the same tent with Latino hater of Blacks while Blacks are very upset over Latinos hi-jacking their civil rights by equating walking across a border to the nearest welfare office, as the same struggle blacks went through in slavery. The Ethic killing of Blacks in LA by Illegal Hispanics will also make his task harder but if anyone can reconcile the groups Obama Hussein is the man.

I think as a seasoned, & experienced drug user Obama and as he says in his book , knowing how to score some blow, he will address how backward, unfair and punitive our drug laws are and legalize drugs. This would release millions of Drug users and drug dealers from prison. They, with their knowledge and experience could go into selling, distribution and expanding the legal drug trade and help our economy and the Black & Hispanic communities. In addition to saving tax payers Tens of Billions now spend in incarceration, prevention and drug fighting cost. Of course, all drugs would have a high tax but still be much cheaper than Illegal drugs. We could earmark the tax receipts from drugs to the millions of Uneducated Immigrants we gave American citizenship to help offset the net cost of 20k per year each cost in public welfare. This would reduced the price of drugs to where the average American citizen could afford good coke, just like the elites and Politicians, This will also reduce the price of creak for our poorer citizens, and make their life more enjoyable. But I fear legalizing drugs will be beyond even Obama. The drugs lords have so many Billions due to high prices , to share with our Politicians to keep our borders open for drugs, illegal immigrants, and terrorist to pour across, that the special interests will never let him legalize drugs. I know Obama, you will do your best and that is all we can ask!

EARTH TO MITTHEADS!

Amnesty, by definition, involves foregoing any penalty for an illegal action.

The bill required a fine. It is therefore not amnesty, and any suggestion to the contrary is, quite simply, a bald-faced lie.

...McCain is a good man, for sure, but soft on illegal aliens and definitely soft on torture....

Posted by: Geotopia | January 4, 2008 9:42 AM

Please tell me you're kidding..."soft on torture"? John McCain is absolutely on the money with his stand on torture. Torture has never been considered acceptable American conduct, and I'm disgusted that there could even be a serious debate in this great country about whether or not torture is acceptable.

This is a prime example of why America's moral standing has fallen so far, so fast in the world. At this point, it's a moral battle we've lost to the terrorists.