by Mark Silva

Sen. John McCain, refuting the contention of Democrats that a vote for him is a vote for a third Bush term, insists he has plenty of differences with the president.

"I have strong differences'' on the way the war was conducted until recently, McCain said in an interview aired by National Public Radio this evening. "There's other differences, but I'm sure that there are other areas that the president and I are in agreement on.... So judge me on my credentials.''

McCain, in the interview aired on NPR's All Things Considered, also told interviewer Robert Siegel that there is a limit to his opposition to "earmarks,'' congressional spending inserted in spending bills at the behest of influential congressmen and lobbyists.

In poverty-stricken places like Kentucky, where he campaigned today, McCain said in a talk held from New Orleans that "I can assure them that the earmarks that they have received, which have been few and far between because they are not represented by powerful lobbyists and special interests in Washington, that we will judge any expenditure of the American people's tax dollars on the basis of need.

"Someone pointed out several earmarks that have been fortunately gifted to some of the neediest people in comparison to the earmarks that have gone, first of all,'' the senator from Arizona said. "For an example, at Gee's Bend they put in a ferry a couple years ago, and that was an earmark. Several years before that, they refurbished a statue of Vulcan for many millions of dollars in Birmingham. In any comparative process, open and authorizing process, the refurbishment of a statue of Vulcan in Birmingham would have taken a far, far lower priority than one that went ahead of it, and that is a ferry for the citizens of Gee's Bend.''

Here, courtesy of NPR, is a transcript of the talk:

MR. SIEGEL: Well, both Senator Clinton and Senator Obama say that electing you in the fall would be the policy equivalent - excuse me, would be the policy equivalent of a third term for President Bush. What do you say to that?

SEN. MCCAIN: Well, I certainly expect that. That's probably what they view as an effective line of attack. And I understand that. The fact is that Americans will select the next president based not on the past but on the future. Certainly they will consider my record, but they will also be very interested in how my vision and my view of America's future in the very difficult and challenging times, both foreign and domestic, is. And we'll have debates and we have fundamental differences in philosophy. And we'll be debating those differences and specific issues, and I look forward to it.

MR. SIEGEL: But in neither past nor future, the present is a Republican presidency, the presidency of George W. Bush. Is it a liability for you in the campaign?

SEN. MCCAIN: No, I don't think so. I think that my record is very clear. I've had agreement with the president on some issues and we've had specific disagreements on other issues. For example: spending. I opposed the spending with everything in me and fought against the wasteful earmark and pork barrel spending, which by the way, Senator Obama and Senator Clinton have also embraced the earmark pork barreling.

I had strong objections to the way the Iraq war was being conducted and fought for the new strategy that is succeeding, in my view. And on the issue of climate change, I'm the only one that has brought up legislation and had it voted on - although it was defeated - trying to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. I have strong differences there. There's other differences, but I'm sure that there are other areas that the president and I are in agreement on.

MR. SIEGEL: You are now in agreement -

SEN. MCCAIN: So judge me on my credentials.

MR. SIEGEL: You are now in agreement with President Bush on keeping the tax cuts in effect, tax cuts that you had opposed. But you also proposed more tax cuts amounting to almost $300 billion. Where will that money come from?

SEN. MCCAIN: Well, first of all, you're talking about over a 10-year period. And those tax cuts, obviously, there's other sources that will counterbalance some of it including I can eliminate $100 billion of wasteful and earmarked spending immediately; 35 billion (dollars) in two big spending bills in the last two years, and another 65 billion (dollars) that has already been made a permanent part of the budget.

The problem is not taxes. And the problem is - the problem is that we have spent and let government get out of control. The problem is the growth of government. The problem is not that we need to raise people's taxes. The problem is that we've presided over a 40-percent increase in the budget over the last eight years. And that's got to be brought under control.

MR. SIEGEL: But when you talk about cutting $100 billion in spending, I mean, the bridge to nowhere - the famous Alaska bridge that you've talked about as the epitome of the useless earmark - is about $350 million. I mean, there's a huge difference between programs like that hundreds of billions.

SEN. MCCAIN: Well, in all due respect, I saved $6 billion in killing off a bogus Air Force tanker deal. I can identify billions and billions and billions of dollars. As I said, I mentioned 35; I mentioned another 65 that's been made part of the baseline of the budget, which has contributed to the largest expansion in government since the Great Society. So the problem is not that we need to raise people's taxes, but we've got to get government spending and increasing the size of government under control. And I believe that I can be effective. I believe that I can bring about change and it's time for action now. And we do see this unbridled growth of the federal budget and the federal government.

MR. SIEGEL: This campaign tour that you're on is the It's Time for Action Now tour. You're campaigning in Youngstown, Ohio, rural Kentucky, Lower Ninth Ward of New Orleans. Most campaigns say it's time for action now or that it's time to finally do something. Why should voters, particularly in those places, believe that you'd do any better by them than other politicians, especially when you might even take away the earmarks that might bring them a new construction project or something like that?

SEN. MCCAIN: I can assure them that the earmarks that they have received, which have been few and far between because they are not represented by powerful lobbyists and special interests in Washington, that we will judge any expenditure of the American people's tax dollars on the basis of need. Someone pointed out several earmarks that have been fortunately gifted to some of the neediest people in comparison to the earmarks that have gone, first of all.

For an example, at Gee's Bend they put in a ferry a couple years ago, and that was an earmark. Several years before that, they refurbished a statue of Vulcan for many millions of dollars in Birmingham. In any comparative process, open and authorizing process, the refurbishment of a statue of Vulcan in Birmingham would have taken a far, far lower priority than one that went ahead of it, and that is a ferry for the citizens of Gee's Bend. So I'm saying to you that the people have been shortchanged because of this pork barrel and earmark project. The people who are least and last represented in Washington, which is our lowest income Americans, and I can prove that.

MR. SIEGEL: But you still don't want to spend any federal money on them do you? I mean, you're against government spending.

SEN. MCCAIN: Of course I do if there's a need. (Chuckles.) If there's a need, we should take care of Americans in need. Frankly, I'm astonished at the question. Of course we need to take care of Americans who are needy. We need to do it through an open, honest, transparent process that is proceeded by hearings and authorization, not by putting in a project not only in the middle of the night but maybe even after the president has signed the bill, which was the case of some millions of dollars to a project in Florida, apparently put in either by the staff or a member of Congress after the bill was passed.

We may have a difference of opinion; I think Americans are sick and tired of the corruption and the process in Washington where earmarks and unnecessary and wasteful spending of their tax dollars, plus increases in spending of greater proportion since any time since the Great Society. I'll bring that under control. I'll bring about change and I'll make them famous, and the time for action is now.

MR. SIEGEL: Do you assume, by the way, that say in 2010, which is when the tax cuts that are approved in 2009 might actually take effect, that the U.S. will be in recession and in need of economic stimulus?

SEN. MCCAIN: I do not know. I hope not. I certainly hope and pray not. But to increase Americans' taxes, including by the way capital-gains tax, which Senator Obama seems to want to do when history shows that every time - going all the way back to Jack Kennedy- every time we have cut capital-gains, it has been an increase in revenues. I mean, that's just a historical fact. So I don't believe - especially if Americans are in continuing economic difficulties - that raising their taxes is a solution. In fact, I think it exacerbates their problems. The answer is growing government - the answer is growing our economy and that increases revenues, and then I think that's the best - I want the American people to keep more of their own money, not have government take it from them and spend it for them.

MR. SIEGEL: Senator McCain, thanks a lot for talking with us today.

SEN. MCCAIN: Oh, thank you, Robert. It's always great to be back on your program. I listen to you with a lot of regularity. And I thank you.

MR. SIEGEL: Okay, Senator John McCain, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, speaking to us from New Orleans.

(AP Photo/Mary Altaffer)