Obama 'wrapped around the axle'

When secrecy, conspiracy, lies and denials fail, cling to the "They kept us safe" meme. BS! Why would anyone listen to this woman? Dana Perino is too seriously stupid to come up with the "wrapped around the axle" metaphor all by herself. I wonder who writes her stuff?

I'm sure she means, right after the 9-11 attack, which happened on Bush's watch !! It's Bush's mess that President Obama is trying to clean up, so, why doesn't Perino, just let the next administration do its job. Her and her inept crew had their chance and muffed it !! We just can't expect anything less from those whining Republicans !!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

The Bush administration "kept the country safe'' with its tactics in the interrogation of suspected terrorists, says Dana Perino, the former press secretary for ex-President George W. Bush.
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What the Bush spokesmodel fails to mention is that Shrub Jr was busy clearing brush and blowing off memos that said: "Bin-Laden Determined To Strike Inside U.S.!" when 9/11 happened.

There's no excuse for the former leaders of this country to have been using deplorable torture tactics in our name. None, zero, zip, nada!

See, all those times they criticised me for torturing people, I told you they wer wrong. Now they admit that I was right, that torture is acceptable. I'm glad to see that they toke my example to heart and have fully embraced my methods of controlling the radical islamic population.

Bush: America does not torture.
Perino: America does not torture.

Both lies! Your 15 minutes are up and it's time to leave the building.

I am all for the GOP crumbling to dust and America evolving towards the Democratic Party and the Green Party for our two party system, but this is just downright super ultra Kafkaesque logic they are now putting out. It is almost sad to witness the party that stood up against slavery has become so mind numbingly tone deaf thanks to immersing themselves in perpetual spin machines that convince them point of view is always the correct view and that if you don't agree with them you're a traitor.

The vast majority of actionable intelligence was and still is procured by the units that befriended and gained the trust of our prisoners instead of torturing them. These units talked to their charges. They gained their trust and once that was established it was much easier to gain actionable intelligence.

And just what did the genuine, "real American heroes", torture squads procure? You have to understand, eventually, a tortured person is going to end up saying whatever the torturer wants to hear to get the torture to stop, which is why those units gathered a lot of information but none of it was actionable because it if it was the Cheney team would have already leaked it before the 2008 election to boost pro-torture and formerly tortured (how sick is that?) John McCain's chances.

If you adopt illegal tactics that you "deplore" in other cultures to "keep you safe" from other cultures, you are keeping yourself save by compromising your own culture, laws, and freedoms. Why are we asking soldiers to give their lives "to protect our freedoms" if we are simply going to let our leaders (like Bush) give them away???? No to illegal torture. No to illegal wire taps. No to giving away the Constitiution. As Ben Franklin said, "Those who will compromise liberty in the pursuit of safety will have neither liberty nor safety."

The Bush spokesmodel speaks; she regularly lied (or read the talking points she was handed) for him, so why should we listen to her now.

Simply stating that Up is Down does not make it so.

You loons win, we won't call it waterboarding. From now on it will be called "Underwater Contingency Planning"

Why don't you loons ever go after FDR for fire bombing Dressden? Do you know how many civilians were killed during those bombings? How about Truman and the Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

FITZ,

How many times did Clinton have a chance to capture bin Laden? President Bush was left behind by Clinton a downsized military and intellgence agency to fight the war on terror.

As for congressional calls for an investigation, she says, members of Congress were brief about the program - "they told the administration to continue,'' Perino adds....
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The America Hating Left is just so obsessed with this “torture” business, but if there is going to be an investigation, please don’t half-step. Now that you democrats have a large congressional majority and there has not been any recent al Queda success for the passive citizenry to have to worry with, you have a big problem with how this lack of al Queda success may have been attained. Either you are just soooooo sanctimonious about “torture” or it is just the real Left blowing off its cover. Not sure which, but go ahead and let’s just break this egg open.

Jay Rockefeller is on the committee that deals with national security. He had to have known what interrogation methods may have been used. Schumer as well. democrats want to fake their moral indignation and claim non-inclusion in the information loop, but let us just see how their positions may have triangulated over the years. This issue has some potential to blow up on you leftists. We may get to see, yet again, the disdain that Harry Reid, Dick Durbin, and associates really have for America and for the young men and women that are unfortunate enough to be placed in the direct line of fire. I do understand that they would never be of any concern to many of you.

fingers and pliers ! and Perino does not rise an eyebrow about that... She does not know??? that is the real banality of Evil. And that why the US administration must be debushified, like Germany was denazified. Otherwise , no one will ever be able to hold any highground ever against torturing nations.There is no 2 lwas, no me or the highway, not the US have the right, but no other nation. Or many good people whether american, german, japanese, russian etc died for nothing between 1939-1945.
Thank you Cheney, thank you Perino, thank you Fox news...

Seems obvious the real reason Reid and Pelosi don't want any investigations of condonation of torture is:

THEY CONDONED TORTURE.

Simple as that.

It's a classic CYA.

Is Obama going to go along with this, help them cover up?

He needs some new political advisors.

One of his promises in his campaign was to get to the bottom of Abu Graib.

Now is he going to help Pelosi and Reid cover up their failed "oversight" and condonation of torture?

A serious error on the part of the Obama administration.

This undetermines the CIA, allows a foreign entity, United Nations open to prosecute US citizens, lawyers (and others) for this "torture".

No wonder Obama went to Europe and said this country was "arrogant, derisive and devisive".

Will the next terrorists please target all these people who are complaining about the "torture" even though they have been safe for eight years?

What was uncovered by those "torturers"
was the PLANNED bombing of the Brooklyn bridge: yeah terrorists, it's the Obama adminstration now, go ahead, plan and bomb; nobody's looking out for the American people now.

That torturing also prevented a PLANNED attack on Los Angeles..yeah terrorists, go ahead and plan that again..there are so many dolts living there..

The "torture" saved American lives here in the US and in Britian.

Obama continues to undetermine this country militarily, economically and leave American citizens open to attack on their own soil.

And since allowing this to become public,opens the door for our soldiers to be harassed in other countries.

If the US is attacked, blame Obama. He is NOT keeping us safe.

Obama's Homeland "security" Secretary, Janet Naplitano, has even accused those who return from serving our country in Iraq and Afghanistan to be susceptible to becoming terrorists. She accused THEM. Put the focus on THEM. She manipulated the political scene by injecting returning soldiers and the Canadian government as promotors terrorism.

68,000,000 americans have failed to do their homework on politicians and have voted into office a man who will lower the quality of life, endanger the citizen of this country.

Vote out democrats. Even stretched faced Pelosi is denying she knew what was happening, even though she was briefed.

Oh well, let Israel go. We fought for their right to survive, now Obama has lessened the ability to do so. Israel will be on its own.

Terry, Many many people from all political stripes have heartily condemned the militarily useless war crime of Firebombing Dresden as I strongly do. The killing of the many thousands of civilian refugees packed into that city was a horrid crime against humanity, that achieved no other end. The fact that the President of the United States at the time was a Democrat in no way changes that fact.

However, what does that have to do with torture, Terry? Does one war crime justify all others? Are we going to toss all the rules of war and all notions of basic human rights out the window? Are we to follow the examples of those nations we used to condemn and fight using any means, without question or remorse? Do you recognize any limits Terry, any at all? Shall we hire the former KGB torture experts to teach the US military and the CIA to torture as effectively as they did? Shall we adopt the methods of the SS to make the military more effective?

Mel,

Its funny how the left, who adores FDR, just glosses over all the "war crimes" he comitted in WW2, but under President Bush - 3 misunderstood young males of the Islamic faith get waterboarded, and the world will end. My point Mel, is the hypocracy ot the left and the media - but I repeat myself.

Yes, I do believe there are limits - waterboarding causes no permanent physical or mental harm. Thousands of our soliders, sailors, airmen, and marines go thru this same treatment. I have no problem with it.

As the old saying goes, "you don't bring a knife to a gun fight"

"you don't bring a knife to a gun fight"
But it would be nice if Terry brought a brain to a debate.

Terry, friend, do you think you might hear more criticism of Bush than FDR because Bush was president last year, and FDR over 60 years ago? You need to read more by the way. There has been plenty of criticism of FDR's war crimes, both foreign and domestic, form many many people identified with the left. Are you able admit even the possibility that Bush may have committed war crimes? Can you even have that discussion on a rational basis?

By the way Terry, where did you get your psychology degree? You have stated that waterboarding causes no permanent psychological harm. I assume that's based on your own scientific research into the issue, which is at odds with the opinions of much of the rest of the scientific community. I assume you yourself have gone through and extensive and repeated series ow waterboardings to ensure that there are no affects, right tough guy?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=103329522

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/08599189272100/print

"As the old saying goes, "you don't bring a knife to a gun fight""

The New saying:

Make sure to bring the ol waterboard to the next interrogation!

Brian at 5:23 a.m.,

Lead placed directly on the target - THANK YOU!!!

Wrong, django, wrong.
If it's immoral, illegal, ineffective, and lowers our standing in the world, why do it? Shame.

Dana Peroxide can do nothing but lie. She'll make a great PR flack.

If torture works, why does it have to be done 183 times to one person? Riddle me that!

Flo,

I think that first and foremost, this is all just Back-At-Cha politics. The new regime persecutes and prosecutes the previous regime. Then the next regime comes in and does the same. THAT, is the way that a Banana Republic operates. Castro avoids this by somehow, some way, being immortal.

Second, I understand that Bush or Cheney get no credit for anything ever, but something apparently worked to save additional attacks on American infrastructure in LA, NY, other places. It is so easy for someone with no personal stake, to be so sanctimonious with respect to something as complex as gathering information from a sworn enemy captured on the battlefield.

We have a legal depatment that reviews and interprets these sort of things. They were signed off on by enough democrats, like Jay Rockefeller, that it should not now be a sudden revelation. So, now we go back, with a different political climate, re-interpret what someone thinks they should have done then, and work up the pyramid prosecuting people?

Does the Marine Corp practice "torture" on new recruits? If I had to crawl through cold mud with tracer bullets flying a few feet above my head, outfitted in skivvies and combat boots maybe, I may argue that is some form of "torture". Are the Marines that come through this sort of thing permanently damaged? Was what was done to the detainees orders of magnitude that different, or worse, than something that we might do to military recruits in training, or SEALS, or pilots in Survival school training?

Flo, please consider this. Some shrewd ACLU type lawyer could argue that the three pirate hijackers would have eventually gotten hungry, seasick, and homesick and just given up if allowed the chance, but Barrack Obama gave the order to shoot them DEAD, and should be put on trial for their murder. WHERE would this sort of Kum-Ba-Yah thinking ever end???

I understand that America has to have higher standards and values than the rest of the world. But at some point, we may want to give some consideration to our own ability to survive. Leahy was talking this morning about constitutional rights, but what constitutional rights are stated or implied in the United States Constitution for non-citizen enemy combatants? How do Liberals answer that? Which section, article or amendment do I need to read to get a better understanding of that Right?

Except for a singular personal exception that you, my amiga, probably could guess, I am not for "Torture". This, however, is just a political inquisition and a bit insane for a nation that claims to be serious about wanting to defend citizens and assets from a group of religious lunatics that think that it their sworn religious duty to destroy, at the very mininum, our way of life. It is political. Leahy, et.ux, know that very well, and what does he care. His natural leftist sympathies has always been with them.

Sunday night, a weekend ends, a work week begins. Django should be gliding along on the neck of a Martin HD-28 or a hot Stratocaster guitar like the end of the world, brought on by Global Warming of course, really is at hand. Instead of tapping into the ethereal network, in search of Wes Montgomery, George Harrison, or Stevie Ray Vaughn, I'm doing Google: Jay Rockefeller + torture, Google: Chuck Schumer + torture. There is certainly some chance that I may have over-stated the case. NOT! I may even have to try Google: Pat Leahy + Gas Bag. There's bound to be some hits there.

This is nothing more than a political witch hunt played up by the usual partisan wind bags. The average American is not going to sort through all of this, and they know that. Unless he is a very good double agent, Leahy probably would not have any "Torture" positions to retract in any case, but Schumer and Rockefeller need to lie low or skunk away. democrats are just so good at this sort of worthless stuff. They are the Wes Montgomery of political wind bagging.

Athena--If tortured enough people will say anything to make it stop. The immoral Bushies wanted someone to say Iraq had something to do with 9/11 in order to justify it's stupid war:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/26/opinion/26rich.html