Obama's healthcare push: 'Economic'

The government cannot even run the Postal Service without having to subsidize it with a few billion dollars every year. The federal government has bankrupted Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare and our children's future .....and this loser of a president wants to run the health care system? Obama is on a mission....all this man wants to do is destroy capitalism!!!! He is a neo-Marxist!!!!

The doctors don't believe a central planned health care system will ever work.

They cite examples such as a bureaucrat in Warshington setting limitations on chemotherapy drugs, and the resultant withdrawal of doctors from the field of oncology.

Government can't be sued for malpractice and neither can the insurance companies who veto therapies.

Doctors feel the problems with insurers are bad enough but likely to be much worse with a central planned health care economy.

On the other hand, just look at the Blue Cross Blue Shield building that was built on the northern edge of Grant Park of Chicago.

The first 30 floors went up about 9 years ago; recently another 30 floors were added on top.

Your BCBS premiums at work!

Does BCBS waste your money more efficiently than the US Govt.?

The trend in US economy is:

Much less health care for everyone,

along with

much less of everything for everyone.

Olympic stadium, anyone?

The opposition to Obama's health care overhaul are using tired and shallow arguments. Particularly the Conservatives for Patients Rights - they offer a misleading and inaccurate argument. ........

http://thefiresidepost.com/2009/05/17/health-care-distortions-by-conservatives/

The opposition to Obama's health care overhaul are using tired and shallow arguments. Particularly the Conservatives for Patients Rights - they offer a misleading and inaccurate argument. ........

http://thefiresidepost.com/2009/05/17/health-care-distortions-by-conservatives/

Posted by: Ohg Rea Tone | June 2, 2009 9:42 AM

Apparently....you are one of the many losers in this country that want somebody else to pay for your health care. What's next...do you want me to pay for your car insurance too?????

Health care will cost the US a huge price. Yes, something needs to be done for citizens and law abiding immigrants. However, if there are no checks on immigration status, that would be irresponsible. Granting all law-breaking illegals an instant citizenship right before any reform is passed wold be wrong, and would put a knife in the backs of Americans--and those who came here the legal way. Anyone who wants to enter America needs to show proof of their own health insurance. Give health insurance to Americans who are working without benefits and to Americans who have lost jobs due to outsourcing and "free" trade. Control the borders better and that would help a bit. Know who is here before giving all a pass to free medical care. If any illegals are served, the medical bills need to be sent to their own governments. Inmates should be given the same health and dental care as the least served law abiding American. Here's hoping the lawmakers will find ways to be more efficient with health care rather than tax employees for employer health care. That would alienate a huge and very voting prone voting block. In the end, many of these employees would be forced to drop their taxed health insurance and the uninsured problem would just be much greater. More screwed up federal intervention. Get rid of the 12 dollar Tylenol tablet while in the hospital or ER. If health care is a matter of national security, put those uninsured in the military health care insurance program. The military could do their own efficient immigration checks. I'd bet they don't charge $12 for a Tylenol. All Tarp and "stimulus" trillions have done nothing for us. Don't throw more trillions to the wind for an unchecked, fat cat health reform bill. Obama is already looking like a teacher who gives a pass to the fat cat bullies while the well behaved little kids continue to be forced to give up their milk money to the fat cat bullies. That's a very bad teacher in charge.

Our current healthcare system is a huge inpediment to entrepreneurship in this country. I know so many people that would like to start their own company, but simply cannot consider it because of the enormous increase in healthcare costs they will face if they leave their job and have to pay for individual health insurance, which cost so much more than what largercompanies who have larger insurance pools pay.

Posted by: Joe | June 2, 2009 9:59 AM

Joe, what are you going to do if you get fired tomorrow and you lose your health insurance? What are you going to do if you have a major health problem at that point and don't have the money for treatment? Are you going to just suffer? Or are you going to be looking for help? What if it was your kid who was sick? Are you going to call them a loser for wanting to see the doctor?

What is the plan? What are the details? How will it work? How are we going to pay for it when we're underwater already with existing Medicare obligations? Let's see an actual plan along with some strait forward talk of how this is going to impact taxpayers. Right now, I see advocacy groups and the Administration arguing for or against legislation that does not even exist yet.

What is the plan? What are the details? How will it work? How are we going to pay for it when we're underwater already with existing Medicare obligations? Let's see an actual plan along with some strait forward talk of how this is going to impact taxpayers. Right now, I see advocacy groups and the Administration arguing for or against legislation that does not even exist yet.

Posted by: Herbie H. | June 2, 2009 11:58 AM

What makes you think I'll go without having health insurance? During my long lustrous work career....I have been responsible enough to save money to buy health insurance for many years to come if I lose my job....remember that "old fashion" plan that Americans used to live with...."save for a rainy day." What an earth shattering concept!!!!! Perhaps this generation should do without the latest Blackberry and take a few lessons from their grandparents! Oh...I'm sorry...that would not be considered progressive!!!!!!

Joe I don't have a clue what you are talking about. I never said you should go without health insurance. I was commenting on the idiocy of arguing the merits of a plan that doesn't exist yet.

Sorry...I copied the wrong post....I meant to copy the post from Nel.

The government should be paying me to go to the hospital every day to watch the water in the water cooler evaporate. I'll call it my bailout, hands off.

Well, Joe, as long as your covered everything is dandy, right? Tell us Finacial wizard Joe, what should the person who has only worked for a couple of years who gets laid off supposed to do about health insurance? I'm sure, beinbg the paragon of virtue that you are, you had millions stashed away by then, but many others don't have the ability to save enough to pay for health insurance for a significant period of time. There are hundreds of thousands of American in that situation right now. They've been laid off through no fault of their own, they've been working hard, saving what they can, but it's just not enough. They'd love to have a job, but no one is hiring. Are those the "losers" you're talking about Joe? Oh yeah, they should sell their blackberry. Brilliant. That pays for half a month of insurance premiums. That should do it.

* * * * *
Posted by: Herbie H. | June 2, 2009 3:02 PM
.
Well, Herbie, maybe we should be arguing the merits of the plan now. Once it materializes, it’ll get run through Congress faster than ex-lax through a goose. It’s not likely that they’ll let us see the actual plan long enough to read it before then. They’re always in such a hurry when they want to move without any public consensus for the details. It’s insanity.

Nel,

Using your logic of what one does when they become unemployed for health insurance, ask yourself what you would do for shelter, food, clothing, transportation, utility bills, ...? You start to prioritize.

How about everyone that takes gov't health care has to give up their internet access, 2nd phone (land-line or cell), cable or satillite TV? I would think healthcare is more important than any of these items. In addition, theri credit cards can't work at restaurants since eating out is a luxury. Cars for teenagers - sell them.

If you were to lose your job and be sued by someone, should the gov't pay for your attorney? We are all just one frivoulous lawsuit from bankruptcy. Let's try to nationalize the lawyers and see how far that gets.

Terry, How exactly does one prioritize if they have cancer, they've been laid off and can't afford health insurance? Got a glib answer for that? Should they have to bankrupt themselves just to have a chance to live? Do you really believe that the things you mention will even begin to pay for the services they need? If you do, you are have no idea what you are talking about.

Nel,
Do you really think that with the 65 billion dollars a year to implement this gov't healthcare that cancer patients are going to get the treatment they need anyway? The money will still have to come from somewhere and the govt doesnt have any.

So then Whit, what's your answer ? Let them die? You're basiocally saying that we need to ration healthcare resources, and that the criteria should be wealth of the patient. Lose your job, lose your life.

Whoa Nellie,

Let's note teh difference between health care and health insurnace.

http://www.texascancer.info/access/accesstocare.html

You don't prioritize cancer, you prioritize the payment of your medical bills and health insurance. The payment of these bills should come ahead of internet access, cell phone, cable TV, etc...

http://health.howstuffworks.com/insurance/catastrophic-insurance.htm

I wonder how many of the unisured have cancelled their cable, internet and cell phone bills and considered buying catestrophic health insurance?

Don't we have medicaid for this exact purpose?

Why screw over the 85% who do have health insurance for the 15% that do not?

Whit,

Do you think that $65 billion/yr will cover 47 million uninsured? That's just under $1,400 per unisured person. Nellie's dreaming if he thinks that amount will cover it.

NATIONAL HEALTH CARE FOR ALL, OR NO HEALTH CARE FOR ANYONE! THE TAXPAYER WILL REFUSE TO PAY FOR HEALTH CARE, OR PENSIONS FOR ANYONE. THAT INCLUDES TEACHERS, PROFESSORS, POSTAL WORKERS, POLICE, FIREMEN, FEDERAL EMPLOYEE'S, STATE EMPLOYEES, AND ANYONE THAT RECEIVES PENSIONS OR HEALTHCARE PAID FOR BY THE TAXPAYER. IF THE CITIZEN'S OF THIS NATION DON'T GET HEALTH CARE, THEN NO ONE GETS HEALTH CARE, OR PENSIONS NO EXCEPTIONS!! ENOUGH OF THE THIEVES (INSURANCE COMPANIES) AND THE REPUBLICANS, LET THEM STAND OUT IN THE COLD! NATIONAL HEALTH CARE OR BUST! DOES SEBELIUS HAVE THE BALLS OR SHOULD WE HAVE GOT HOWARD DEAN TO MANAGE THIS PROBLEM! whiteagle38

Terry, are you seriously sugesting that an unemployed person can afford health insurance by canceling their phone and TV? The average cost of carrying Cobra insurance coverage is around 83% of the average unemployment benefit. That's not a matter of "prioritizing" that's a matter of starving. Then you suggest that the person get catastrophic coverage. That's just great. Leave them without basic coverage so that by the time cancer is discovered it's too late to do anything about it. And no Terry, Medicaid doesn't cover many people in that circumstances.It does not simply cover all low income people Terry, didn't you know that? Most adults without children are not covered. In some cases for eligibility you cannot have assets worth more than $2000. So you're not just giving up the phone and cable, your giving up the house, the car, your savings, and most every other possesion you have.
http://www.cms.hhs.gov/MedicaidEligibility/Downloads/MedicaidataGlance05.pdf
http://www.esresearch.org/Documents/MedicaidAdults.pdf
No worry though. Sacrificing 15% of the population is no big deal. Their lives aren't worth any inconvenience to the rest of us. You're covered, so there's no problem at all, is there?
Got any more glib answers there Terry?

Whoa Nellie,

An unemployed person has a lot of problems, including health insurance. He has problems paying his mortgage, car payments, credit card bills, real estate taxes, car insurance, food, clothing utilities.,..

Do you want the gov't to take care of everything for the unemployed?

To solve this issue is to solve the unemployment problem, which this President doesn't have a good record on so far.

Catastrophic health care would cover everything once the cancer is discovered, so the only out of pocket is the routine visit which discovers the cancer - hardly a financial backbreaker - the cost of one's monthly internet/cable bill.

Screwing the 85% by shoving gov't health care down their throat to solve the problem of the 15%

Just who are the uninsured - of the non-elderly, 47% of the uninsured have incomes at over 200% of the poverty level. 1/6 of the uninsured come from families wioth incomes 400% over the poverty level - might this be an individual choice of these people?

Terry,again you are just massively ill informed. Most catastrophic coverage plans carry a huge deductible, on the order of $5,000. That's money you have to pay out of pocket, per year, before the insurance kicks in the first dime. So, contrary to what you say, it will not cover everything for the cancer. Not even close.

Terry, the difference between healthcare and many of the things you name is that healthcare truly is a matter of life and death. There are programs to help provide food and shelter to keep people who have fallen on hard times alive, but not for healthcare in many cases.

But none of that matters in talking to you, does it? You honestly don't see a problem, or care in the slightest what happens to that 15%. You have health insurance, so that's all that matters. Let them suffer, let them die even, what's it to you? Nothing. Nothing at all.

Whoa Nellie,

We'll have the gov't pick-up the deductible for the uninsured that are poor. Much, much cheaper than shoving a gov't program down the throats of 300 million Americans, of which 253 million don't need it.

The problem is you are trying to kill a mosquito with a sledge hammer. Use the right tool for the problem.

See who the uninsured are - not all of the 47 million need help.

http://aspe.hhs.gov/health/reports/05/uninsured-cps/index.htm#income