by Joe Markman
A sea of angry taxpayers marched on the Capitol on Saturday afternoon. That much is certain.
But even before the march was over, the news media, bloggers and rally supporters were wrangling over the crowd count, with estimates ranging from 60,000 to 2 million.
The Daily Mail in England initially reported that 1 million people flooded the west lawn of the Capitol, protesting what they called the dangerous big-government policies of President Obama. Some conservative blogs claimed 2 million attendees.
The two groups that sponsored the event offered more modest but widely varying numbers. Pete Sepp, a National Taxpayers Union spokesman, said the group estimated the crowd at 75,000 in the morning and from 200,000 and 300,000 as the day went on. FreedomWorks spokesman Adam Brandon put his "conservative" estimate at 600,000 to 800,000 after comparing photographs of Saturday's protest with previous events.
Although no official crowd estimates were issued, local officials and an expert indicated the number was more likely under 100,000, still a sizable turnout.
Farouk El-Baz, a Boston University research professor and expert on crowd estimation, said his informal research from press coverage indicated 75,000 as the peak number. Pete Piringer, a spokesman for the District of Columbia Fire Department, said he made an unofficial estimate of 60,000 to 70,000 at the beginning of the event.
Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority spokesman Steven Taubenkibel said Saturday that ridership figures indicated an extra 87,000 people took the subway all day, a significant increase over the 350,000 average.
Confusion and anger over crowd estimates are as much a part of Washington as its marble monuments. Organizers of the Million Man March in 1995 threatened to sue the National Park Service over its crowd estimate of 400,000, when their own number was 1.5 million to 2 million.
See the full report on the TEA Party crowd count in Tribune newspapers and here in the Swamp, below the fold:
(Media Matters reports that, "Conservative media have repeatedly provided conflicting crowd estimates for the 9/12 March on Washington, citing tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, and in some cases, millions of participants, while one unofficial D.C. fire department estimate placed the number between 60,000 and 75,000 participants. On his radio show, Glenn Beck said a "really conservative" estimate is 500,000 based on photos, and on Fox & Friends, co-hosts Steve Doocy and Gretchen Carlson alternately claimed that "tens of thousands" attended and that "hundreds of thousands" attended.'')
Boston University's Center for Remote Sensing estimated the Million Man March crowd at 837,214, with a 20% margin of error. The center, headed by El-Baz, used aerial photographs provided by the Park Service to do a computer analysis of the turnout.
Afterward, Congress directed the agency not to produce estimates.
"We do not give crowd estimates for any event, any time, whatsoever, period," said National Park Service spokesman Bill Line.
The controversy this weekend was fanned by the Internet. Bloggers circulated a photo showing a mass of people on the National Mall as evidence of a larger crowd. But it turned out the photo was taken at least five years ago: The National Museum of the American Indian, which opened in 2004, is not on the Mall in the picture.
El-Baz said the only accurate way to measure attendance is by counting heads in a photograph taken from an airplane or satellite, an expensive undertaking. No such photo was taken Saturday, to El-Baz's knowledge. Airspace over the National Mall is restricted.
"There is just no way for anybody [on the ground] to estimate the crowds," El-Baz said of people trying to do rough counts. "Most of these [other] numbers are not even in the ballpark."









Comments
The foaming at the mouth Teabaggers are nothing more than a bunch of toothless rednecks.
Typical Republicans - they can't count and they can't spell.
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http://community.livejournal.com/ontd_political/3983339.html#cutid1
Posted by: I wanna be a Republican idiot | September 15, 2009 2:18 PM
There were a bajillion people there! Everybody supports the Great Leader Glenn Beck!
Posted by: Teabagger 1,999,876,765 | September 15, 2009 2:21 PM
TEABAGGERS LIE ABOUT THE ATTENDANCE AT THEIR ASTROTURFED "PROTEST" SATURDAY IN DC - FreedomWorks Misquotes ABC News on Tea Bagger Turnout
Whackjob Michelle Malkin is claiming 2 million turned out in Washington, D.C. today to "celebrate" the day after 9/11. The organizers, Freedom Works claimed that ABC News was estimating 1 to 1.5 MILLION turned out.
Uhhh...actually? ABC News didn't say that at all.
They said 60,000-70,000.
Oops.
According to ABC News:
"Conservative activists, who organized a march on the U.S. Capitol today in protest of the Obama administration's health care agenda and government spending, erroneously attributed reports on the size of the crowds to ABC News.
Matt Kibbe, president of FreedomWorks, the group that organized the event, said on stage at the rally that ABC News was reporting that 1 million to 1.5 million people were in attendance.
At no time did ABC News, or its affiliates, report a number anywhere near as large."
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http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/protest-crowd-size-estimate-falsely-attributed-abc-news/story?id=8558055
I can believe they turned out 60,000 or even 70,000 people. They probably photoshopped the crowds to make them look bigger. But deliberately misquoting ABC News? Really?
Did these Teabagger idiots really think they'd just let that one go?
They keep crowing about how "well organized" the tea baggers are. I'd say they are good at rallying a solid core of right wing whackos, after all, they have a huge anti health care lobbying group (Freedom Works organizing it for them and a fake news outlet (Faux "News") giving them free publicity in the days leading up to this. The Teabaggers are obviously to stupid to realize that they're being led around by the nose by the very same corporations who are keeping them dumb and poor. But when those numbers didn't approach what they fantasized about, they are reduced to lying about it even when there's no question that they're going to get called on it.
Maybe after 8 years of a Bush administration that was capable of getting away with murder, both figuratively AND literally, in broad daylight and under the glare of media scrutiny, the Right must think they can just do and say whatever they want and nobody will notice.
NEWSFLASH TEABAGGERS: You're liars and we notice.
Posted by: qrtdk | September 15, 2009 2:22 PM
Had to be a million Saturday, or they couldn't call it the "Million Moron March."
Posted by: David | September 15, 2009 2:41 PM
This is why the Republican party can't win elections anymore - the entire party has been taken over by an echo chamber of low IQ toothless rednecks who still haven't figured out that outside of their little cult people view them as being repulsive.
And I love how they're all claiming that they're going to win in 2012.....win with who exactly? Palin? Mittens Romney? Goober Huckleberry? Racist Joe Wilson? ha ha ha! The Teabaggers are all just as delusional as their hero Crazy Glenn Beckkk is.
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http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/9/14/779699/-912-Teabaggers-in-their-own-words
Posted by: sok | September 15, 2009 2:42 PM
Violent criminal/Teabagger brings gun to Obama health care rally in Minnesota!
Josh Hendrickson of Rogers, MN, brought two concealed handguns to President Obama's health care rally in downtown Minneapolis on Saturday. He was seen by police and questioned, but not arrested.
Hendrickson, it turns out, was convicted for assault and just released from jail a few weeks ago.
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http://www.startribune.com/local/59288822.html?elr=KArksLckD8EQDUoaEyqyP4O:DW3ckUiD3aPc:_Yyc:aUUT
Thanks to Tim Pawlenty, Minnesota has been a conceal-carry state since 2003, which basically requires a county sheriff to issue a permit to carry a concealed handgun, with certain exceptions.
Hendrickson has a concealed carry permit. However, according to the conceal-carry law (MN statute 624.714), the sheriff is not required to issue a permit if the person is prohibited from carrying a firearm under other Minnesota statutes, including MN statute 624.713. And that law prohibits anyone from carrying a firearm in Minnesota if they have ever been convicted of a violent crime. (Minnesota statute 624.712 defines violent crime to include all forms of assault.)
Furthermore, according to 624.713,
A person named in subdivision 1, clause (2) [i.e., has committed a violent crime], who possesses any type of firearm is guilty of a felony and may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than 15 years or to payment of a fine of not more than $30,000, or both.
Now here's the interesting thing: Hendrickson was stopped on the street by Minneapolis police, and by the Secret Service, and questioned, at the rally on Saturday. But he was not arrested.
So here was a guy, just out of the joint after his conviction, therefore ineligible to possess a firearm under Minnesota law, standing on the street outside a Presidential venue carrying to pistols. Thus, he is committing another felony. And, as he is standing there committing this felony, he is being questioned by the cops, who do NOT arrest him.
It's easy to think of racism as the unjust things cops do to black people. Sometimes, racism is the unjust things cops let white guys get away with.
I'm surprised that the Teabaggers can't see that outside of themselves, people see them as a bunch of repulsive thugs, which makes even more people turned off by the Republican party than they might have been before.
Posted by: Keith Pickering | September 15, 2009 3:04 PM
This is why I only get my news from 3 sources - PBS, BBC and the Swamp. Quote me.
Posted by: Pink | September 15, 2009 3:13 PM
Ah those Tea-Bladders! Always with the mavericky exaggerations.
(Watch out Troll Buster! The secret Tri-lateral commission is ready to pounce again!)
Swamp at large: Check it out.
http://www.swamppolitics.com/news/politics/blog/2007/10/i_believe_ill_dust_my_broom.html
Anyone that wants to join the fun, by all means, do so.
Posted by: C.Morris✧ | September 15, 2009 4:03 PM
I am sure these numbers are exagerated. When they had a Tea Party in New Lenox, IL, they stated the crowd was 10,000 but it looked more like a 1,000.
Posted by: Kim K | September 15, 2009 4:22 PM
Seriously, who cares? The only good coming out of this story is the comedy of watching a bunch of Swamp libs get their panties in a bunch. Again. And how did professor El-Baz become an "expert" in crowd estimation? Is that like a course I can take at a community college?
Posted by: Herbie H. | September 15, 2009 4:41 PM
LOSERS!
Posted by: chuck | September 15, 2009 6:21 PM
And how did professor El-Baz become an "expert" in crowd estimation? Is that like a course I can take at a community college?
Posted by: Herbie H. | September 15, 2009 4:41 PM
Dr. El-Baz is a well respected researcher who specializes in analyzing remote sensing technology information. The methods he uses for determining crowd sizes are based on methods he developed to count sand dunes in satellite photographs of the earth.
http://www.crdf.org/profiles/profiles_show.htm?doc_id=699543
I know you right wingers hate science, and think that anyone who has gotten more than a community college degree is an over educated elitist, but it really is sad how proud you all are of your ignorance.
Posted by: Ben | September 15, 2009 6:32 PM
Geez, HH, we're all laughing at it.
Posted by: C.Morris✧ | September 15, 2009 8:52 PM
Ben, you misjudge me. I actually love sand dunes.
Posted by: Herbie H. | September 15, 2009 9:59 PM
I find it humorous that a recurring theme in your collective rants is the stupidity of the conservatives, yet you have managed to exhibit your own ignorance, in that you are unable to differentiate between to, too and two, a basic lesson. Oh, now I suppose that makes me a racist, too! Additionally, I think the 1200 physicians who had their own rally, the myriad business owners in attendance would, and I, a magna cum laude graduate of Catholic University of America definitely do, take exception to being called "low IQ toothless rednecks." Is this the best you can come up with to engage in a 'civil dialogue?' Your vitriolic responses to the march, specifically, and to those of us who disagree with you, generally, are oh, so telling. Like a small child who doesn't get their way, they throw a tantrum. To quote from some of your more erudite responses, "WAA, WAA, WAA!"
Posted by: mlw | September 15, 2009 11:54 PM
Posted by: mlw | September 15, 2009 11:54 PM
;
Well, you've proven you can use big words but you have not given me a reason to vote Republican. I guess that's because your ideology has proven to be a failure during the 6 years of control of White House, Senate and House of Reps. The Republican philosophy drove America into a ditch.
Posted by: devin | September 16, 2009 10:26 AM
What the Hey? Ever note that the Tea Bags are all white?? Its the lunatic fringe of the Republican party, neo nazis, neo cons, right wing nuts, racists, and dumb rednecks that don't understand that they have been brainwashed!!! whiteagle38
Posted by: Raymond L. Juneau | September 16, 2009 6:47 PM
I guess these rants are yet more evidence of the left's moral and intellectual bankruptcy. They can't seem to come up with a VALID response to attacks on BO and the rest of the left, so they resort to petty namecalling. Pathetic.
I guess I must be a racist. Oh wait, I'm of Hispanic descent.
I guess I must be stupid. Oh wait, there's that PhD from Maryland and the tenured position at a Research One university.
From my perch here in the Ivory Tower I see thousands of students who were instrumental in electing BO. They have NO CLUE about what is going on in the world. Many of them can't name their Senators; virtually none can name their Representative. They have NO IDEA what has happened in the US over the past few years, other than what they learn from a grossly biased media.
Posted by: TomA | September 17, 2009 11:07 AM
Man those tea baggers are crazy. Our country will be so much better off when we are saddled with 9 trillion in debt, why cant these toothless rednecks see that.
Posted by: Thomas Foran | September 21, 2009 4:57 PM
I have done my own study based on devised methodology and calculation which you can find here:
http://deathbymedia.wordpress.com/2009/09/22/912-washington-dc-tea-party-rally-crowd-estimation/
It's backed by evidence (pictures and clips) and determining the boundaries of the protesters and calculation of final tally derived from the density of the crowd at each given block. My calculus puts the figures around 130k up to 160k.
Posted by: deathbymedia | September 22, 2009 11:37 PM
WOW! The old adage "Ignorance is Bliss" must be true, judging from this uninformed, vitriolic site.
ROTFLOL at the posts here.
Posted by: tickedoff2 | September 24, 2009 8:48 AM