Obama's health win: 'Let's make history'

Never in American history has so sweeping a bill been passed with such bipartisan opposition and such narrow support.

This is a bill no one read, and no sane person would vote for after they read it.

Seeing how Peelosi and gang hide it(the bill) how do we know whats in it. But, now it will have to stand the light of day it will most likely die. And it is not even real reform and the people of the congress know it. I want real reform not a take over. Real reform would being able to sale insurance across state lines, that alone would start to lower cost within a few months. They want to clear up Medicaid and Medicare, they do not need this bill to do that and they know it. They have only a hand full of people in CA working to stop Medicare and Medicaid abused, WHY?

And the president's fund raising for the take over says a lot. The Tea Party movement is for real and growing. And what the house passing this bill will only make it bigger. And no matter with the far left says or the MSM reports about the Tea Party movement. It is made up of more then just the far right or Republicans but, of people from all parties and color of skin. Nov 2010 can not get to soon.

It was not very good for the Trib just to publish the Democrats that voted against this bill. How can Obama say with a straight face that by cutting Medicare of 400 billion it will help Senior Citizens. Has Obama gone completely mad. Next if Pelosi, and Obama were so sure that this Health Plan was really great then why did it pass with just 2 votes over the 218 needed for passage. The only thing I'm sure about is that there will be more taxes to pay because of this plan.

Let's make history!!!!!

Let's destroy America!!!

This president needs to go. He is destroying America. He has done more harm to this nation than any other president at an alarming rate.

Vote every democrat out of office, NOW before it's too late. We must not let them kill America.

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 42% now favor the health care plan proposed by President Obama and congressional Democrats. That’s down from 45% a week ago. Fifty-four percent (54%) now oppose the legislative effort, up three points since last week. Only 23% of all voters Strongly Support the plan while nearly twice as man (44%) are Strongly Opposed.

See you NOV 2010.

Anyone who voted for this debacle needs to go, voted out.
Any one making more then the Federal Poverty Level, $14572, will be required to have HC Ins. or be levied $1000 and/or jail time.
The Gov. will impose an annual fee to its "competitors" AKA the private insurance industry of $6.7B, driving up cost to all Americans. Sec 102, Grandfathered clause will, eventually, force everyone on the Gov plan.
The House of Representatives is no longer representation of their constituents, the majority, who do not want a 'public option' It's the House of Special Interest.
Your representation has been hijacked.

Any possibility of future balance budgets are gone. This bill will be a job killer once tax rates on the job creators go from 35% to 45%.

BO will need to revies his 10 year deficit upward from $9,000,000,000,000. I wonder if all those college kids that voted for the great speech-maker will be happy that when they find a job, they will be taxed thru the nose. For all of you flatliners that say BO is only taxing the rich, try again - he has already broken that promise.

Speaker Dimwit says now that this bill has increased the number of citizens insured in this country from 83% to 96%. Aren't the other 4% important? Just who are these 4%?

We never learn it seems:We pass a fraud Health Care bill in the house by a slim margin with the democrats not needing one vote from Republicans and watching Pelosi gloat makes me want to PUKE.
While we allow these clowns to demolish our economy and our Children's economy with these bills we are not keeping our eye on the ball as Barney, Frank, Maxine Waters, Charley Rangel , Chris dood , Chuck Schumer, Leahy, durbin have allowed Freddie Mac to lose $5,000,000,000 this year.

FREDDIE MAC posts $5 billion loss...a Headline today from a competitor odd the Tribune didn't carry the news or the rest of the "fringe" media in Obama's pocket.

Let's make history!!!!!

Let's destroy America!!!

This president needs to go. He is destroying America. He has done more harm to this nation than any other president at an alarming rate.

Vote every democrat out of office, NOW before it's too late. We must not let them kill America.

Posted by: charles | November 8, 2009 10:17 AM
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Do you have any idea of how nuts you appear ?
Just another rightwing whiner mad that Obama won the election and is making good on one of his campaign promises.
Now if only Obama can end these horrible pointless wars in Iraq & Afghanistan....

Let's make history!!!!!

Let's destroy America!!!

This president needs to go. He is destroying America. He has done more harm to this nation than any other president at an alarming rate.

Vote every democrat out of office, NOW before it's too late. We must not let them kill America.

Posted by: charles | November 8, 2009 10:17 AM
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Do you have any idea of how nuts you appear ?
Just another rightwing whiner mad that Obama won the election and is making good on one of his campaign promises.
Now if only Obama can end these horrible pointless wars in Iraq & Afghanistan....

I would have much rather have had Hillary elected. At least, she'd be able to stay true to Democratic values. This way the vote would either be for a universal plan or against it. A real referendum on whether or not we are ready to seriously being to think of health care problems in solid need to fix terms. This bill is crap, but, like the bailout, will be happily passed into being because it's out of sink with the public, who continues to "benefit" at their own expense, and it secures the government's interests, before the people; the bailout (unnecessarily) slowed down the inevitable (did not prevent it) and this bill will slow down the inevitable but it will not prevent the deterioration of the health care industry in America (we always shelter the burden time and time again). The Democrats don't mind compromising on their values (health care as a human right not just humanly affordable), because, deep down, a compromise for them is a way to keep their wealthy connections happy.

Pelosi said per CNN:

"Democrats voted for the bill and a Republican voted for the bill. That equals bipartisan," Pelosi said later.

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What would possess someone to say something so stupid? How dumb does Pelosi think the American people are? Even her liberal supporters have to cringe when she says something like that. The nuts are running the asylum.

Hey, all of you, Republican-Libertarians, are you really that stupid or are you just trying out a new comedy routine ? In either case, you are woefully wrong !! Since the beginning of humanity's climb out of the slime, group cohesion and cooperation, have been a necessity, not a luxury !! What is a group, but the many, working for the common good. Then, there appears, almost by " divine right", the king, the CEO, who, begins to deny members of that group, certain prerogatives, certain freedoms, that only they are allowed to continue to enjoy. Out of that social construct, capitalism is spawned !! The essence of capitalism is profit and where does profit come from, but the production of goods and services. Already, there is a great divide between the persons who work to produce these goods and services and those who finance their production, which includes the owners and management. To make a long story short, the capitalists and their agents, assumed that God was again on their side and that allowed them to disrespect, exploit and debase, not only men and women, but even children, in other words, the workers. That is when God gave the group, a great idea: The unions !! Once again, group cohesion and cooperation would allow them to escape from the slime of capitalism. would allow the many to work for the common good. It wasn't meant to be, for the capitalists had all of the money and they bought the best government, money could buy. That government, systematically, for 50 years has tried to destroy that great idea, God gave to us, workers. Fortunately, that God-given idea is still working its magic, forcing the management-owners, the capitalists, to respect, to pay a living wage and stop exploiting us, the people. You can not destroy a good idea, I don't care how much money you throw at it, from now, until eternity. America was in great economic shape when the unions were a player on the national stage. Now, we have let the Corporations move our good paying jobs to cheap labor markets, over seas or outside of America. Then, we have allowed them to return those foreign made goods, back to America, charging the same prices, we would pay, had they been made by labor union, American workers. Our own government was part of this diabolical scheme, the government helped in the financing of the moving of the good jobs, to cheap labor markets. As I wrote, above, we have the best government money can buy !!
That is why the well orchestrated opposition to President Obama. He wants to, and is working towards, eliminating the chasm between the haves and the have-nots, but the Corporations want that divide. They want to maintain their " chosen people " status. They want to think they are special and, therefore, they are entitled to be paid 500-1000% more than their average workers. That is why the absurdity of the charges from the Republican-Libertarians, about socialism, communism, even the silliest charge of them all; Hitlerism. Can anyone with any reason, give such a nonsensical utterance the time of day, let alone, any serious consideration. I do not think so, but the Republican-Libertarians will make them silly charges, daily.They have nothing else to offer America, but to denigrate and insult our President, President Obama. Their silliness is hilarious, because in the same breath, they want us to think of them as real and honest Americans, yet they act quite the contrary !!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE.NOW.

This has nothing to do with "reform" and everything to do with power and control. This bill is a disaster for America. Wake up, folks. Our freedoms and tax dollars are nothing more than Obama's Marxist play things.

I would bet the Tea Party movement just got a lot bigger. And now the Left can start their childish name calling. But, come Nov 2010 I'll play Who's Crying now for them.

The Left seems to forget that now the bill can be read.

As the spouse of a young adult cancer patient, I would like to thank Rep. Lipinski, Rep. Bean, and the rest of the Democrats and 1 Republican in Congress who voted for this historic legislation. This legislation will help those of us who have health insurance keep it, prevent health insurance companies from denying coverage to those who need it most, save $100 billion over 10 years, and cover 36 million uninsured Americans. As the events of yesterday showed, the Democrats are the party that is serious about trying to address the problems facing average Americans, rather than rich lobbyists and unhinged teabaggers.

Healthcare needs fixing, but this was not the way to go about it. Finds for people that do not want to buy health insurance this is smacks of Nazism or better yet Socialism. This is going to be the Dems albatross come 2010 and 2012. Mark my words the Dems will pay dearly in the coming elections.

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Posted by: Don Fitzgerald, IL | November 8, 2009 12:46 PM
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Don,
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We all thought you were a gullible cheerleader and retarded Marxist at heart. Now you went ahead and proved it.

Forcing people to pay or face jail time. That's the way the facist liberals govern. Meanwhile 20-30 million illegal aliens will not face the same penalties, but will receive all the benefits.

They will be covered. Heck they are covered right now. We pay for their free healthcare, their education and any other social program that they qualify for. The is no verification of citizenship and there won't be will this bill. THE GOVERNMENT SIMPLY WON'T ENFORCE THE LAW, JUST LIKE IT WON'T BUILD A FENCE AND ENFORCE OR IMMIGRATION LAWS.

Posted by: Moses2317 | November 8, 2009 1:35 PM

As the spouse of a young adult cancer patient, I would like to thank Rep. Lipinski, Rep. Bean, and the rest of the Democrats and 1 Republican in Congress who voted for this historic legislation. This legislation will help those of us who have health insurance keep it, prevent health insurance companies from denying coverage to those who need it most, save $100 billion over 10 years, and cover 36 million uninsured Americans. As the events of yesterday showed, the Democrats are the party that is serious about trying to address the problems facing average Americans, rather than rich lobbyists and unhinged teabaggers.
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As a cancer patient I say to you BS. And using childish name calling just shows who is unhinged here. And if you read the whole CBO report and not cherry pick like the Democrats and the MSM did. You would have read how anything has to go just right for any savings. And the new taxes will start once the bill is signed but, the so called reforms would not start until 2013. And out of the 36 million uninsured Americans, how many are illegals, how many choose not to have insurance (young & dumb mostly), how many can pay as they go (That is right the RICH). The real number is under 10 million. OK you can be childish now and call me names.

This bill uses the word "shall" 3,400 times

With the use of the word “shall”, the choices and liberties of the American people to choose what they want are clearly undermined.

In the name of equality, the democrats/liberals represent tyranny. Which do you want as a nation - more freedom to choose or 3400 mandates?

Maybe once this goes through the rest of the process and they come out with the FINAL bill, my daughter will be able to afford insurance on her own and we can stop paying the exorbinant COBRA fees. She was denied from three health insurance companies because she sought emergency care after a flood light fell on her foot and injured it. It was a "pre-exisiting condition".

BTW -- I would like to know how many Republicans, Teabaggers and others who are against this bill have taken advantage of the H1N1 vaccine that their government is giving out free of charge? Isn't that government intervention in your heath?

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BTW -- I would like to know how many Republicans, Teabaggers and others who are against this bill have taken advantage of the H1N1 vaccine that their government is giving out free of charge? Isn't that government intervention in your heath?
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Posted by: lochnessmonster | November 8, 2009 5:45 PM
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Umm … to which H1N1 vaccine were you referring? I didn’t get vaccinated, and I don’t plan to. Many people haven’t gotten vaccinated either because the government ran out. The government’s order for the vaccine isn’t going to be filled until December. I hope you are happy with a government run health care system runs with the same efficiency employed in getting H1N1 vaccine to the public. When you need six of something, you’ll get 2.
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And, no, providing a vaccine for the H1N1 virus isn’t intervention into my health. Unlike the health care bill that just passed out of the House, the government isn’t holding a gun to my head to tell me to get vaccinated. If you can’t tell the difference, then good luck telling the difference between a beggar and a robber.

The one good thing that will come of this debacle is that Demoncraps will lose big time in 2010. Melissa Bean is one that MUST go. Mark Kirk must get elected as senator.
But in the meantime:
OBIMBO MUST BE REMOVED FROM OFFICE NOW! NOT NEXT WEEK. NOT NEXT MONTH. NOT NEXT YEAR. NOT IN 2012. BUT NOW! (thanks, Don)

Moses,

How can this bill cover 36 million uninsured when only a few weeks ago, BO said that only 30 million were uninsured?

In positing an argument against this bill, it is not necessary to fabricate issues. There is nothing in this bill that would "{force} people to pay or face jail time" (Gary). If there is, tell us on what page it is located. you are right on one point; why are we being forced to purchase insurance? How can this be constitutional?! This bill on its own is too costly, and does not resolve the underlying problems with insurance issues plaguing so many people. It creates a new way for insurance executives to unconscionably increase their already overly greedy salaries and benefits. It does us in IL no good to try to get our senators to vote against it, or to table the issue while we attempt to rationally discuss the matter, but people in other states may have some success in doing so.

Yay!!! One small step for Congress, and one giant leap for America. :-)

SEC 101.h.2
INSUFFICIENT FUNDS- If the Secretary estimates for any fiscal year that the aggregate amounts available for payment of expenses of the high-risk pool will be less than the amount of the expenses, the Secretary shall make such adjustments as are necessary to eliminate such deficit, including reducing benefits, increasing premiums, or establishing waiting lists.
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WOW and they said this would not happen.
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SEC. 307.c.1.A

TAXES ON INDIVIDUALS NOT OBTAINING ACCEPTABLE COVERAGE- The amounts received in the Treasury under section 59B of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 (relating to requirement of health insurance coverage for individuals).
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Hope its not like MA?
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SEC.765.d.2

Training individuals who are from disadvantaged backgrounds (including racial and ethnic minorities underrepresented among public health professionals).

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Money (grants and contracts) provided for public health workforce training will be awarded with racial preference.
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SEC.2531.a.4.B

the law does not limit attorneys’ fees or impose caps on damages.
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A Democrat pay off to all the lawyers for their support.
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And that is just a few things. There is a lot of stuff about taxes on just about everyone.

As the spouse of a young adult cancer patient, I would like to thank Rep. Lipinski, Rep. Bean, and the rest of the Democrats and 1 Republican in Congress who voted for this historic legislation. This legislation will help those of us who have health insurance keep it, prevent health insurance companies from denying coverage to those who need it most, save $100 billion over 10 years, and cover 36 million uninsured Americans. As the events of yesterday showed, the Democrats are the party that is serious about trying to address the problems facing average Americans, rather than rich lobbyists and unhinged teabaggers.

Posted by: Moses2317 | November 8, 2009 1:35 PM

I'm sorry to hear of your trouble.

But the same congressmen who voted in favor of this monstrosity refused to include themselves or their families. They're keeping their Rolls Royce coverage and tossing us scraps. You should be very afraid. And if you actually believe that any government program is going to save taxpayers money, well, I just can't help you with that.

Forcing people to pay or face jail time. That's the way the facist liberals govern. Meanwhile 20-30 million illegal aliens will not face the same penalties, but will receive all the benefits.

Posted by: Gary | November 8, 2009 3:58 PM

Where are you getting this information Faux News? The biggest Xenophobes of your party? This is a Flat Out Lie!! This Health Care program DOES NOT INCLUDE illegal aliens. Only
citizens and legal residents younger than 65. End of story!!

Why is it that you Teabaggers have no issues with paying high taxes to fund two wars that are unwinnable. paying taxes to bail out Wall Street and Greedy bankers, but have issues with paying taxes in keeping your own citizens healthy and then in the long run saving our country billions in health care costs?? WHY???

Bug eyes McConnell (R-KY)spouts out that he wants less government intrusion and less spending. Seems he had no issue at all with the wild spending under the previous administration. And if he wants big government out of his life, I say when he retires, big government deny him his pension, healthcare, and all social security benefits. McConnell is a vile and foul smelling hypocrite.

Posted by: John W. | November 8, 2009 6:40 PM
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Why don't you respond to the first part of lochnessmonster's post about his daughter being denied coverage by three private insurance companies? Is ti because you're afraid to admit the fact that the public option is good for Americans? Or is it because you sincerely believe that it's okay for the USA to have finite resources for health care but unlimited money for war?

Don, I actually agree with ONE of your comments. But you err when you equate the King to the CEO. The King is the government! CEOs cannot put you in jail or tax you or take away your rights. I think you'll have to agree you got that backasswards.

Also, God did not give the idea of unions. Unions ARE a socialist idea and socialists are atheists.

Capitalism came about because of our competitive nature; it rewards those that succeed. Socialism punishes achievement and rewards laziness.

Now for what I agree with: Our government has been instrumental in outsourcing good paying jobs to India, China, Mexico and other countries; how? Through NAFTA. You remember NAFTA, Don. Remember Ross Perot talking about that big sucking sound of jobs being taken out of the US? And, who passed NAFTA? You remember Don. Rahm Emanuel was the guy that got NAFTA through, and Clinton signed it. And where is Emanuel now? OH, he's Obama's CHIEF OF STAFF.

And you STILL don't see the light.

And you STILL don't see the light.

Posted by: Gary | November 9, 2009 2:52 PM

I suggest it is you who doesnt see the light. You people seem to forget that without NAFTA you wouldnr be able to buy that large screen TV for $400. DVD players wouldnt be $29 either. Your mobile phone bills would be triple their cost, that $3.50 Starbucks you so cherish would be $10! Not to mention the gas you put into your SUV will skyrocket due to the fact that the US imports most of its oil from Canada and Mexico!
You want to get rid of NAFTA which in turn would increase consumer prices tremendously and lower the GNP. I'm sure you'd be the first to complain at the gas pump!

Scottie,

I can't believe I actually agree with you on free trade. Way to see the light!!!

Now if only the BO administration would open up this trade policy with our best South American ally, Columbia, we could continue to move forward.

Hey Scot, you tryin' to say that gas is CHEAP? Because of NAFTA, come on!

Yeah, you get all the cheap crap you want imported and sold through Wal-mart. We also have a trade imbalance; we import more than we export. But, there are about 50 million Americans out of work that probably would rather have their jobs back.

And what good is a big screen TV when we won't build any power plants to provide electricity and those crazy liberals have plans to ban them? Oh, and they also raised gas taxes...

http://www.usnews.com/money/blogs/fresh-greens/2009/01/06/california-may-ban-big-screen-tvs.html

California May Ban Big Screen TVs
ShareComment By Maura Judkis

Posted: January 6, 2009

State legislators in California are drafting regulations that may prevent California retailers from selling power-sucking big screen TVs by 2011.

Scot, I know you only are allowed to get your news from the STATE APPROVED NEWS SOURCES, so you don't know anything...Ilegals will be covered under the bill. There is nothing in the bill that calls for documentation of US citizenship.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/Obamacare-wont-cover-illegal-immigrants--55021087.html

"Under H.R. 3200, a 'Health Insurance Exchange' would begin operation in 2013 and would offer private plans alongside a public option…H.R. 3200 does not contain any restrictions on noncitzens—whether legally or illegally present, or in the United States temporarily or permanently—participating in the Exchange."

CRS also notes that the bill has no provision for requiring those seeking coverage or services to provided proof of citizenship. So, absent some major amendments to the legislation and a credible, concrete enforcement effort in action, looks like the myth on this issue is the one being spread by Obama, Reid, Pelosi, et. al.

Chairman ObaMao's health package does not stand a snowball's chance in hell of getting past the Senate. That is a no brainer.

Scottie,

I can't believe I actually agree with you on free trade. Way to see the light!!!

Now if only the BO administration would open up this trade policy with our best South American ally, Columbia, we could continue to move forward.

Posted by: Terry | November 9, 2009 3:40 PM

WOW no kidding! And yes I agree with you regarding SA as well. Am I dreaming?

Scot, I know you only are allowed to get your news from the STATE APPROVED NEWS SOURCES, so you don't know anything...Ilegals will be covered under the bill. There is nothing in the bill that calls for documentation of US citizenship.

Posted by: Gary | November 9, 2009 4:09 PM

Sorry buddy, it' syou who is mixed up with the bills not me. The House healthcare bill bars illegal immigrants from enrolling in the public option and from receiving subsidies for health plans. Xenophobia is the new black by the way.

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/66649-immigration-threatens-vote

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Posted by: BC | November 9, 2009 9:58 AM
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Dear BS … er … BC,
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How was I supposed to respond to the first part of lochnessmonster’s post? He made a factual statement regarding his daughter’s health insurance dilemma, and a hope (on his part) that insurance would become more readily available or cheaper when the bill went through. What was I supposed to say to that? Was I supposed to say that it’s not true that his daughter was denied coverage for a pre-existing condition? How should I know? Maybe I should have written that insurance won’t be cheaper if and when the whole health care plan makes its way through Congress. That might be true. Then again, how would I know and why should I care?
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You then pose a series of false dilemmas by first suggesting that I withheld comment because I secretly harbor the belief that the public option is good for Americans, and then by suggesting that I think it’s more important to fund wars than health care. This is unadulterated BS (and hence your new moniker).
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In the first place, I do not - and never will - support either the health care bill or the public option it contains. The whole thing is the largest power grab by the federal government (at least) since the New Deal. Never before has the federal government attempted to regulate the behavior of its citizens and residents simply because they exist. Never before has the government attempted to force individuals to purchase specific products or services, with a monetary penalty for failure to do so, simply because they live here. It effectively mandates the confiscation of property for the benefit of already too powerful corporate interests.
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If this bill survives, it threatens to give the federal government unlimited power; and it sets a precedent that could be used to develop a command economy. After all, if the government can order an individual to purchase health insurance, then why can’t it force people to buy cars, or clothes, or houses, or specific food items? Where, then, would be the power of the individual to make intelligent choices about his or her own liberty? What, then, stands in the way of the federal government from ordering businesses to refrain from making certain products and to produce others (thus adopting a command economy)? If it has the power to order those into the market who have resisted being pulled into the market, then what can’t it do by the artifice of creating a market and then coercing people into it?
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The first thing one learns in a course on Constitutional law is that the federal government is supposed to be a “limited government” in that it can only exercise those powers delegated to it by the Constitution. An act in excess of those powers is what we call “unconstitutional.” The House bill is an attempted end-around the limitations imposed by the Constitution. If this bill is passed and allowed to stand, there won’t be any effective limits on the federal government’s power. It should be no surprise that a number of congressmen and constitutional scholars question not only the wisdom and efficacy of the bill, but its constitutionality as well.
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In the second place, even if I could turn a blind eye to the bill’s dubious constitutionality, I still couldn’t agree that the bill represents a wise exercise of power. This is the federal government we are talking about. You know: the same government that has run both Medicare and Social Security so poorly that both programs are threatening to bankrupt us soon? The government tells us the program is going to cost a mere $1 trillion over the next ten years. Do you really believe that? Do you realize how bad the federal government is at anticipating costs? Do you know, for example, that the estimated cost of Medicare for this year once was one thirty-second of what it turned out to be? Has it ever occurred to you that all the waste and fraud that occurs in the federal government is caused by the federal government being too big and inefficient to police itself? How, then, is the situation going to get any better by making it even bigger and more inefficient? On top of all of this, the bill gives your life over to the insurance companies so that they can continue to gouge you with the federal government’s blessing. Yeah, that’s really wonderful.
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I am not surprised that you think the whole thing is a good idea, because people like you never look past the immediate result of some proposed act to determine if it is good or bad. You like the idea the government is handing out plunder, but you never look down the road to contemplate its future ramifications. It is because of nearsighted people like you that the federal government is all fouled up. You just have to keep throwing someone else’s money at solutions that don’t work.
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In the third place, I abhor the idea of elective wars or using offensive force in pursuit of any political or social policy. The amount of money available for war should be limited to that which is necessary to DEFEND the country against outside aggressors, and not a penny more. That means that we should not only get out of Iraq, but also that we should close our military bases around the world. That’s further than any of your Democrat buddies in Congress would be willing to go on the subject. (And - BTW - in case you didn’t notice, I’m not a Republican.) In which case, my reticence for supporting the health care bill has nothing to do with wanting more money for war.

Posted by: Scot S. Blakeley | November 9, 2009 9:18 AM

Where are you getting this information Faux News? The biggest Xenophobes of your party? This is a Flat Out Lie!! This Health Care program DOES NOT INCLUDE illegal aliens. Only
citizens and legal residents younger than 65. End of story!!

Why is it that you Teabaggers have no issues with paying high taxes to fund two wars that are unwinnable. paying taxes to bail out Wall Street and Greedy bankers, but have issues with paying taxes in keeping your own citizens healthy and then in the long run saving our country billions in health care costs?? WHY???
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Liberals, I know you only are allowed to get your news from the STATE APPROVED NEWS SOURCES, so you don't know anything...Illegals will be covered under the bill. There is nothing in the bill that calls for documentation of US citizenship.

On Saturday, the rule was adopted on the House floor by a vote of 242 to 192. (Roll Call Vote 882). The adoption of the rule eliminated any chance that the House would consider any immigration related amendments to the bill. During debate on the bill, Rep. Nathan Deal stated the following: "make no mistake about it, illegal aliens will receive government-funded health care under this because all they are required to show is a Social Security number and a name. There is no way to prevent the same Social Security number from being used by numerous individuals, and there is no requirement that a picture ID be produced in order to prove that the person is in fact the name that appears on the Social Security card. If you think identity theft is a problem now, just wait until this bill passes." (Congressional Record, November 7, 2009, H12836). The House later passed H.R. 3962 - without any fixes to the immigration problems contained in the bill - by the slimmest of margins: a vote of 220 to 215.

Gary I used your post because I read it and after reading Scot S. Blakeley's post I felt it would work.

And did you know there are a total of 13 new taxes in this bill in one form or another. And race based schooling too. WOW Team Obama hope for who?

Posted by: Crooks_In_DC | November 9, 2009 7:21 PM

FOFLMAO!! Nathan Deal? LOL! Had yo ucome back to me with a Democrat saying what he said then I might consider your fears. OMG! No kidding someone else ''could'' use someone else's SS card a DUH! But they could also use your credit cards, and drivers licences and passport and anything else for that matter! Your a nut case man, no substance in your posts. Nothing concrete at all. Just inuendos, hypotheitcals and predictions. They used to call that Voo Doo economics. I guess its just plain Voo Doo now.

Amazing Scot, you love open markets when trading with other countries, but don't want to see open markets within the US?

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Posted by: Scot S. Blakeley | November 9, 2009 8:41 PM
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Scot, who are you kidding? You and I both know that immigration reform is going to be on the President’s and Congress’ agendum next-year. And you also know the President and congressional Democrats will be pushing for an amnesty bill that allows illegal aliens to stay and to have a means of acquiring legal alien status or even citizenship. When that happens, all the people we now call “illegal aliens” will be legal residents and eligible to participate in whatever health care program is available. In which case, it is fairly certain that the health care plan will, in fact, cover our current illegal aliens. To claim that there won’t be any illegal aliens covered is just a lot of semantic gobbledygook.
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In addition, Crooks_In_DC has a point when he claims that a lack of enforcement is going to effectively allow illegal aliens access to the program even if they don’t participate in the amnesty program coming soon to a Congress near you. You respond merely by scoffing, but you don’t address the substantive issue of how to preclude the ineligible without some effective enforcement mechanism. Lack of enforcement is already a problem with handing out public assistance benefits to ineligible recipients. And furthermore, you have to know that certain Democratic caucuses have been actively lobbying to keep the enforcement mechanisms weak in order to benefit those who take advantage of our system illegally. See http://www.numbersusa.com/content/nusablog/beckr/november-5-2009/pleasing-hispanic-caucus-or-being-liar-obamas-healthcareimmigration-t?jid=281558&lid=9&rid=2627&tid=807766 Do you get the hint, or do I have to draw you a picture?

Crooks, you can't expect liberals to know anything. They get their news from the White House lapdog news media.

All this bill is, is another tax hike and government takeover of freedoms. 3400 time the bill uses the command "shall." What a joke.

Posted by: John W. | November 9, 2009 10:39 PM

You're just projecting whatyou assume will happen next year regarding immigrants in the US. Whatever the case may be, this country was founded on immigrants and should continue the same path. Not to mention most of these illegals are cleaning your houses and baby sitting your kids! Oh but they shouldnt be allowed amnesty god forbid.

Posted by: Terry | November 9, 2009 9:50 PM

This health care bill gives Americans a choice of private health care insurers, company insurance or a government plan. What part of that isnt free market? If this bill was Universal Healthcare and elliminated all other insureres then your post would make snse, but low and behold and as usual your post has no merit standing. Presume all you want about what may or may not happen, its all so boring.

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Posted by: Scot S. Blakeley | November 10, 2009 5:02 PM
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No, Scot, I’m not merely projecting. I wish I was, but that’s not the case. The president and his White House cronies have made it clear that they have plans in the upcoming year to legitimize the illegal aliens already present in this country, including giving them a pathway to citizenship. See http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2009/08/obama-immigration-reform-to-start-moving-by-the-end-of-the-year-.html and http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/09/us/politics/09immig.html . If they are allowed to stay here legally, and even given a path to citizenship, they wouldn’t be ‘illegals’ any more, and there would be no good reason not to allow them to participate in the health care plan under its explicit terms. Therefore, to say the plan isn’t going to cover illegal aliens is just a bunch of semantic gobbledygook like I said. And, besides, you still haven’t answered the contention that the verification and enforcement mechanisms are too weak to keep illegal aliens from participating.
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And don’t get me wrong when it comes to immigration. I’m totally in favor of legal immigration. My mother and my father’s mother both got off the boat in the 20th Century. I understand better than most that this country was built on immigrants. In fact, I think something should even be done to fix the legal status of illegal aliens in this country to allow them to stay and work here. But I don’t think we should be giving them citizenship, health care benefits, social security benefits, or any other federal handouts to which they haven’t contributed. And furthermore, citizenship should be limited to those who have been admitted to the country under the existing quota system. Otherwise, we are not being fair to all the other legal immigrants who played by the rules in getting here and applying for citizenship. If those who entered illegally want to become citizens, then they should go back and do it right.

Scottie,

Why a gov't plan? Is there a gov't option for your groceries? clothes? computers?

If state boundaries were opened, there would be 1300 opitions for health insurance. I don't think a 1301st would be necessary?

Why a gov't plan?

Posted by: Terry | November 10, 2009 6:48 PM

Because Terry its the right thing to do. Universal health care is implemented in ALL industrialized countries, with the exception of the United States!! It is also provided in many developing countries that have far less money than we do!

You cant seem to comprehend the long run benefits of a healthier nation. All you see is what may happen, who may have to pay, how it may affect our economy who may or may not be eligable, how many illegals might take advantage, bla bla bla. Its time to do something with our money at home for a change. For our own people not some tribes that hate us. Its now time to catch up with the rest of the free world already and get our life expectancy rates up and our high infant mortality rates down!
Thats why.

If gov't provided health care is the right thing to do, then should gov't provide food, clothes, housing, etc...?

Just where are we going to get the money for this as we go to $12,000,000,000,000 in debt and will be adding another $9,000,000,000,000 to that in the next decade.

The golden goose won't do it, ask the state New York as theri rcih flee the state for greener pastures (lower taxes). That 45% tax rate is sure going to be a job creater. You can count on a value-added tax coming in the next couple years - which will tax all Americans and turn our economy into the pile of dung they have in Europe.

Posted by: Terry | November 10, 2009 10:41 PM

The golden goose won't do it, ask the state New York as theri rcih flee the state for greener pastures (lower taxes). That 45% tax rate is sure going to be a job creater. You can count on a value-added tax coming in the next couple years - which will tax all Americans and turn our economy into the pile of dung they have in Europe.
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That is just what the Left wants. They want a total welfare state. The USA is not a small little EU member state and even then they can not got free care to work right.

From the UK:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/09/03/health/main5284708.shtml

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/6127514/Sentenced-to-death-on-the-NHS.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1209034/The-babies-born-hospital-corridors-Bed-shortage-forces-4-000-mothers-birth-lifts-offices-hospital-toilets.html

If we want we should be looking at Germany.