On defense, Dems push Social Security

Every responsible pundit in the United States acknowledges that Social Security and Medicare need to be reformed in the very near future or the programs will bankrupt the nation.

If the Democrats are going to demagogue the issue then how can the problem be addressed?

The people need responsible leadership not political gamemanship!

If the Democrats don’t want to privatize Social Security, that’s fine. But if something isn’t done, and soon, the Social Security program is going to die a loud, ugly death. It is on the verge of bankruptcy now. So instead of criticizing Republicans for wanting to do something, maybe the Democrats had better come up with one of their patented “new” ideas (that Republicans reputedly never have) to see that Social Security remains funded and operable.
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However, I don’t hold out any hope that the Democrats will fix their little monster any time soon. They have to figure out how to produce many tens of trillions of dollars to pay all the outstanding obligations to the soon-to-retire baby boomers. That is, of course, unless the Democrats view defaulting on these obligations or national bankruptcy as desirable options.

You want a ponzi scheme? Check your 401k balance. Mine hasn't even started to recover from the 08 debacle. Before that it had just recovered from the 01 debacle. Before that it had just recovered from the 87 debacle. Before that . . . .

Several ways to improve the situation;
Small increases in FICA over twenty years.
Increase the cap incrementally over years
Legalize and issue SSNs to current illegals to increase the base paying in.
When the economy improves the balance sheet will improve again.

C Morris, unbelievable. Illegals are low wage earners, if you gave them a SS# they would pay a little into the system, but they would draw twice as much out through the Earned Income Credit where a family can receive $5700 from the system. Since SS is NOT kept separate from the general fund, it's a loss to the system.

SS is the biggest Ponzi scheme ever created.

"The Ponzi scheme usually entices new investors by offering returns other investments cannot guarantee, in the form of short-term returns that are either abnormally high or unusually consistent. The perpetuation of the returns that a Ponzi scheme advertises and pays requires an ever-increasing flow of money from investors to keep the scheme going.

The system is destined to collapse because the earnings, if any, are less than the payments to investors."

It is criminal that our political leaders have to play politics over Social Security, especially in election years. Just about all of our elected leaders know that Social Security is running into big time trouble and the program must be fixed. But scare tactics such as demagoguing this very important issue is counter productive. But I forgot this is election year better known as "Silly Season" when politicians will say anything to get elected.

It is criminal that our political leaders have to play politics over Social Security, especially in election years. Just about all of our elected leaders know that Social Security is running into big time trouble and the program must be fixed. But scare tactics such as demagoguing this very important issue is counter productive. But I forgot this is election year better known as "Silly Season" when politicians will say anything to get elected.

@Pat H...do you know what a pundit is? It is a journalist. So you get your economic advice from responsible journalists? Try an economist, not Fox news. Also, it would have been pretty awesome if social security was put into the stock market in 2008. (sarcasm duly noted)
BTW, I think it is one month, or quarter, in Iraq/Afghanistan would bridge any gap for social security. Putting funds into social security will prevent so much spend - nursing homes, hospital bills and other welfare for the old could pay out there ss checks - that I am not sure how a true fiscal conservative would not want to feed into it now.
Do Republicans really feel that if they save a little money that it is okay to screw anyone? Just come out and say you are greedy, or want to help your political donors out, and that is why you support something. I might respect a Republican dogma if they didn't have lie and distort to get people to buy in. I wouldn't agree with it, but no need to spread lies.

You want a ponzi scheme? Check your 401k balance. Mine hasn't even started to recover from the 08 debacle. Before that it had just recovered from the 01 debacle. Before that it had just recovered from the 87 debacle. Before that . . . .

Several ways to improve the situation;
Small increases in FICA over twenty years.
Increase the cap incrementally over years
Legalize and issue SSNs to current illegals to increase the base paying in.
When the economy improves the balance sheet will improve again.

Posted by: C.Morris | September 1, 2010 3:16 PM

Check the balance sheet on the largest sector of your 401K portfolio ( assuming it is on some sort of mutual fund)... find any company that your plan is invested in and look at the debt that is being held by that company - or industry for that matter...
Now look at the debt that Social Security is holding ( in the form of benefit obligations that can't be met based on current inflows of money)... Now-would you invest your real money ( opposed to borrowed or printed fed money) in a company as poorly mismanaged and in debt as SS is?
Gwarawnteeeee that your 401K has radically outperfomed SS - especially on the 20+ year time frame you are referencing- and more importantly WILL continue to outperform SS ( which would be in Chapter 7 Bankruptcy outside of La La Fed Land)
As for what to do- IMHO…
-Sunset Soc Security- if you are under 30... tax deferred ( or free?) retirement investing for individuals- and employers able to make tax free company match contributions to individuals...
-Over 30- Opt -out offered with a reduced (cash) payout option - to allow individuals to be treated like adults to invest their own hard earned money as they see fit- they would have access to the same tax deferred savings as the youngster I had mentioned above...
-Current SS recipients- no change -
-Sop the assault on earning and wealth creation in this country - give employers some clue on what can be expected with taxes, insurance, regulatory, and health care costs- so they can start figuring out how to start earning, hiring and investing again.

Everyone- we have amassed a huge, unsustainable amount of unfunded obligations- it is naive to think that we can solve the problem with only increasing FICA taxes or reducing benefits- -- it will have to be both. But the mature thing to do at this point is to at least insulate our kids and grandkids that have yet to earn ANY money from being responsible for our liabilities.

Hmm, i thought the Dems were going to run ads on how great Obamacare is, How the 800 billion dollar stimulus is working to keep unemployment from exceeding 8%(opps it's 9.5) and how the economy is growing by leaps and bounds during "recovery summer" (economists are bracing for double dip)? The Democrats are toast. They wasted a whole year didling with a socialized healthcare takeover that no one wanted and now they think that talking about SS is going to save them?

Free to watch,
SS doesn't even fit the definition of Ponzi scheme you posted.
There are no short term promised huge returns. There are no promises of fabulous wealth. That scenario fits much more closely my financial planner's rhetoric down at, well, they have changed names so often, who knows who they really are.

It's also a pay as you go system. Pay for 40 years, get your benefit at 62 or 66. Nobody getting a check is a leach. They, we, had to pay all their working life, and the longer and larger the amount paid, the larger the monthly benefit.

HB,
You at least posted some sincere solutions. But I maintain the best solution for our children and grandchildren it to preserve the system. It seems to me entrusting Social Security funds to the current crop of thieves on Wall St. would be tantamount to hiring a known child molester to babysit the kids.

On defense!? I don't think so. Haven't the Republican-Libertarian-T.Baggers proclaimed loudly that they will end Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, if they ever get back in power. That has been their mantra for 35 years. My only suggestion; Check out what our tax dollars are already doing for our healthcare and the health of our nation. Go to: http://www.healthcare.gov/
That is where our nation should be focusing, not on the hate and lies of the Rabid Right!!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

Ugghh,

Since you asked, Pat H has hit the nail on the head. No leadership or ideas from the dems, they just want to scare seniors.

CM,

Just to add to the great thoughts of my fellow conservatives:

Your 401K is a retirement vehicle that is for a 40 year period. The stock market, as I'll represent by the DJIA, has increased from 758 to 10269 over the past 40 years. Much better return than SS's paltry 2% return - less if you are above average. Are you above average?

GOP THEFT BY DECEPTION AXIS OF EVIL DOERS SPEAK! Those are "our peoples" 11 Million unattested "Z" People! Those are
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Free to Watch the Liberal's Summer Meltdown-

You have to be either a US Citizen, or a resident alien to qualify for EITC.

DUFFY SPEAKS! I drank the TEA! Taste Vitter! Less filling! Taste Vitter! Less filling! I heard the voices! Sarah is the GOP TEA PARTY AMERICA EVE IN EEVS! Beck sold us so! Beck told us so! I'm the $6.00 Dollar Initiative unto you! Toto came home! Kobach told me so! Dorothy came home! Kobach told us so! I drank the TEA! Sarah is the EVE in EEVS! Rush told us so! Bush/Cheney 'sold" us so! It was always about "civil rights." THEY LIE! YOU LIE! While walking, talking, that SB1070 AZ WAY! Beck sold us so! Rush told us so! Tancredo told us so! I drank the TEA! I'm in the PARTAY! Hey! Hey! What we say go! 3.5th for me, 3/.5th for you too! Taste great! Taste Vitter! Taste great! Taste Vitter! Ginrich told me so! 9 90"s IN NINE!

Ugggh, your post makes no sense. Ask me if I'm surprised...what exactly are you saying? The unfunded liability of SS and Medicare are way beyond our current worth.

http://www.forbes.com/2009/05/14/taxes-social-security-opinions-columnists-medicare.html

"To put it another way, the total unfunded indebtedness of Social Security and Medicare comes to $106.4 trillion. That is how much larger the nation's capital stock would have to be today, all of it owned by the Social Security and Medicare trust funds, to generate enough income to pay all the benefits that have been promised over and above future payroll taxes. But the nation's total private net worth is only $51.5 trillion, according to the Federal Reserve. In effect, we have promised the elderly benefits equal to more than twice the nation's total wealth on top of the payroll tax."

So, what the hell are you talking about?

Frankly that is an irresponsible ad. Social Security, depends on more and more funds coming into the system to pay out benefits. If this way tried in the private sector someone like Bernie Maddoff would go to jail. But, with the government, HEY it's no problem; it's different.

A pyramid scheme or Ponzi scheme is a scheme no matter WHO proposes it. Liberals have shown that they love to kill the economy with things that sound really nice, like affordable homes, home ownership is a right, health care is a right. BS. You want to KEEP TESTING THIS IDEA, go ahead. Why do you think nobody is hiring right now? No one is going to work their ass off to pay for your lazy ass to do nothing. For reference, see the failure of socialism.

You cannot have a RIGHT based on someone else having to work to support your right. That is slavery. Yeah, don't you know that the south thought that they were entitled to use other HUMAN BEINGS?

SS is doomed. It has to fail. There is no way to prop it up. Those that don't really need it should have the benefits cut, and the whole idea needs to be brought into a separate system from the general fund. I know this will never happen, that's why it's doomed.

Social Security will get a temporary fix after the November elections. It is too big a program and issue to allow to fail. It is the "Sacred Cow" of all Federal programs. And both the Democrats and Republicans know that. But it is Election Year better known as "Silly Season" and unfortunately there are some out there that will demagogue the Social Security issue for personal political gain.

There is nobody better to handle your money than the banks or Wall Street. Just ask my bank....or the bank that bought them out...or the bank that bought them!

Martin, CM's proposal was to give SS numbers to illegals in order for them to pay into the system. A social security number would allow illegals to file a tax return and claim EITC. Many already do with stolen SS numbers.

http://quispisyummy.newsvine.com/_news/2010/04/07/4129260-illegal-immigrants-cashing-in-on-earned-income-credit-eic

Rubenstein also cited figures from the General Accounting Office (GAO) showing that as many as a third of all EITC claims are “improperly paid.”

Comparing Social Security to a month, a year or even a decade in the stock market is intellectually dishonest. Social Security is a MINIMUM 35-year investment. It's really more like 65 years (the life expectancy of an 18-year-old). According to the CBO's latest report, even the average American can now expect to lose money to Social Security. That's a far cry from Ida May Fuller, who famously paid $24.75 in Social Security taxes but received $22,888.92 in Social Security benefits. What was someone saying about Social Security not being a Ponzi/Pyramid scheme...?

" Bill Woessner ", that pales in comparison to that astute capitalist, Bernie " The MadCap " Madoff, and his take at the Wall Street Casino !!
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

Posted by: Free To Watch the Liberal's Summer Meltdown | September 2, 2010 1:27 PM

And you and others here seem to assume they will stay illegal and poor.

Perhaps with the way the whole country is jiggered toward the advantage of the oligarchy perhaps you are right, but I would hope there is still an upward path for the poor.

Social Security would be part of that path.

Dems push for Social Security!
Your kidding right, Nobama has
taken away any cost of living for
SENIORS for the next two years. I hardly call that looking out for Social Security. The sooner this guy is out of office the better off America will be.

There is nobody better to handle your money than the banks or Wall Street. Just ask my bank....or the bank that bought them out...or the bank that bought them!

Posted by: bill r. | September 2, 2010 11:20 AM

I thought yours, Rob's and dimwit Donnies bank was the welfare division of the United States of America bank?

A ss number alone does not qualify someone for EITC.

BillR,

Do you stuff your money in the matress? How is it sleeping on pennies?

Martin, CM's proposal was to give SS numbers to illegals in order for them to pay into the system. A social security number would allow illegals to file a tax return and claim EITC. Many already do with stolen SS numbers.

http://quispisyummy.newsvine.com/_news/2010/04/07/4129260-illegal-immigrants-cashing-in-on-earned-income-credit-eic

Rubenstein also cited figures from the General Accounting Office (GAO) showing that as many as a third of all EITC claims are “improperly paid.”

Wishing all of America, a great Labor Day, on Monday. Thank God, the men and women of America stood up for their rights, as workers, not to be treated like work animals. Fighting against the abuses of child labor, for 8-hour work days, a 5-day work-week and the benefits of vacation time. Those are some of the benefits Labor fought for and made possible, for all the workers of America. We thank them for their struggle and for their fight for fair work laws and safe workplaces.
Happy Labor Day, everyone. Be safe.
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS, BRING THEM HOME, ALIVE AND WHOLE. NOW.

PFUTZ,

A happy Labor Day to you also. On this day as the country pays homage to labor, one needs to remember, without the capitalists, there would be now need for labor.